[pypy-dev] Question on the future of RPython

Saravanan Shanmugham sarvi at yahoo.com
Sat Sep 4 04:56:49 CEST 2010

----- Original Message ----
From: Paolo Giarrusso <p.giarrusso at gmail.com>
To: Saravanan Shanmugham <sarvi at yahoo.com>
Cc: Stefan Behnel <stefan_ml at behnel.de>; pypy-dev at codespeak.net
Sent: Fri, September 3, 2010 5:15:47 PM
Subject: Re: [pypy-dev] Question on the future of RPython

On Fri, Sep 3, 2010 at 21:06, Saravanan Shanmugham <sarvi at yahoo.com> wrote:
> Stefan,
>    If I were to go with my impressions, based on you being the lead developer
> of Cython, I could have claimed you have an ulterior motive on this thread.

> But then I didn't because, inspite of first impressions/scepticism I believe 
> are all here with a genuine interest to improve the Python environment

While you didn't initiate the flame, I think that's totally
inappropriate, and I can say so even without knowing Stefan.

Sarvi>> I believe it is an appropriate response to the flame bait.
BTW, I was very careful not to make the accusation. 
No real offense meant.
It was just a what if argument to drive the point that if every one responded 
like that, based on impression and presumptions,  it would be wrong.
So I standby that.

You wrote:
> Lets not be a little presumptious shall we.
Well, rereading previous comments it is clear that:
a) you don't know well some basics of virtual machines which have been explained
Which is fine, but then you shouldn't consider yourself a peer to
developers of these projects. And you shouldn't claim you have done
proper research if you just used the projects.
You are welcome to be curious, but with such a comment you are the
presumptuous one.
Note that I already remarked that Stefan's comment was not appropriate in style.

Sarvi>> We may have to agree to disagree here. 
I don't believe my thread of discussion has anything to do with Virtual Machines 
at al. 
What I have been saying has more to do with compiling plain RPython code into 
C/C++/ASM executables.

Shedskin uses a statically typed restricted version of Python that gets 
converted to C++
PyPy does convert a statically typed restricted version of Python to C that can 
then be compiled to an executable.
So though with different approachs the final goal is to produce an compiled 
binary executable for the RPython code.

Agreed PyPy does additionally allow using Language/JIT hints to help 
write/generate JIT compilers as well.

That does not remove the possibility that the statically typed version of 
Restricted Python used by Shedskin cannot be full subset of the PyPy RPython.
Nor that there is a possibility of using PyPy as just a plain/pure Restricted 
Python compiler. pure and simple.

This thought angle has nothing to do with Virtual Machines, really.

b) your email client _is_ crappy, given the way you reply inline (I
was mentioning crappy clients in my previous email).
Socially speaking, in an Open Source community, not using a decent
email client can look as bad as dressing very very wrong. I'm not so
picky, but it does mean you're not a hacker.

Sarvi>>> Point taken. 
I use plain Yahoo Web Mail. Do you have any suggestion how I could do better 
with the Yahoo Web Mail client???
I am open learning a better way. :-) Will look into it.


Note I'm not a developer of PyPy, and I don't claim being an expert,
but I have some technical knowledge of its documentation about
internals and of some literature, and some small experience with a
Python implementation.

Best regards
Paolo Giarrusso - Ph.D. Student


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