From victor.stinner at gmail.com  Wed Jun  5 23:17:05 2013
From: victor.stinner at gmail.com (Victor Stinner)
Date: Wed, 5 Jun 2013 23:17:05 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] hg clone cpython newrepo aborts
In-Reply-To: <CAPOVWOSn+Vd73Fgr9h2r7vCGbpN2rvTTAQhBDgKLj-0sYC68OQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPOVWOSn+Vd73Fgr9h2r7vCGbpN2rvTTAQhBDgKLj-0sYC68OQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAMpsgwb8RA9o+BVnos2MG7=TNb-uUWBGf8R0kpM2XirOC75hmA@mail.gmail.com>

2013/5/28 Senthil Kumaran <senthil at uthcode.com>> While trying to clone
a cpython repo to a new repo. I am getting this error.
>
> getting Lib/idlelib/idle.bat
> getting Lib/idlelib/idle.py
> getting Lib/idlelib/idle.pyw
> getting Lib/idlelib/idle_test/@README.txt
> abort: data/Lib/idlelib/idle_test/@README.txt.i at 7573717b9e6f: no match
> found!
>
> Is something wrong with the repo?

It's a bug in mercurial. I filled a report upstream:
http://bz.selenic.com/show_bug.cgi?id=3954

Victor

From g.brandl at gmx.net  Mon Jun 10 10:12:07 2013
From: g.brandl at gmx.net (Georg Brandl)
Date: Mon, 10 Jun 2013 10:12:07 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] 3.2 -> 3.3 merge pending?
In-Reply-To: <CAPOVWOS8Dod5LZK72D8fp9rdf5NC=+ufRax6Z=KWEJzUPSG1dQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAPOVWORQWVsmdNHj-2F8QytQLpbkCHVSsdkvgQKLN9riUztb0g@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130529144104.C20672504B4@webabinitio.net>
	<CAPOVWOS8Dod5LZK72D8fp9rdf5NC=+ufRax6Z=KWEJzUPSG1dQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <kp41o4$vd6$1@ger.gmane.org>

On 05/29/2013 10:27 PM, Senthil Kumaran wrote:
> 
> On Wed, May 29, 2013 at 7:41 AM, R. David Murray <rdmurray at bitdance.com
> <mailto:rdmurray at bitdance.com>> wrote:
> 
> 
>     I asked about this on IRC and was told that 3.2 is now a standalone branch
>     like 2.7.  Security fixes will be applied by the release manager only,
>     and Georg doesn't see any point in null merging the commits.
> 
> 
> Well, there is no harm in merging 3.2 to 3.3. I think, 3.1 remains merged to 3.2
> even if 3.1 is under security only mode.
> 
> It will be our practice that we do not port bug fixes to 3.2. This can be
> mentioned in the Misc/README. But when it will be a security fix, it will go
> through 3.2->3.3->default and having them merged may be a good idea.

No, security fixes will be cherry-picked back to the 3.2 branch, which is easier
in the case of only few standalone commits.

Georg


From ezio.melotti at gmail.com  Mon Jun 17 22:54:20 2013
From: ezio.melotti at gmail.com (Ezio Melotti)
Date: Mon, 17 Jun 2013 23:54:20 +0300
Subject: [python-committers] Language Summit at EuroPython
Message-ID: <CACBhJdHKGFTho4QNxp33B7sq70AQqcUxtfhBHcFAuJ0Xunmh8A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,
are there any plans about doing a language summit at EuroPython this year?

Best Regards,
Ezio Melotti

From michael at voidspace.org.uk  Tue Jun 18 16:09:27 2013
From: michael at voidspace.org.uk (Michael Foord)
Date: Tue, 18 Jun 2013 16:09:27 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] Language Summit at EuroPython
In-Reply-To: <CACBhJdHKGFTho4QNxp33B7sq70AQqcUxtfhBHcFAuJ0Xunmh8A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACBhJdHKGFTho4QNxp33B7sq70AQqcUxtfhBHcFAuJ0Xunmh8A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7B4EC6C3-95E8-479B-8EBB-E66AFFDA4999@voidspace.org.uk>

Hey Ezio,

There are no plans that I'm aware of to have a language summit at EuroPython, sorry.

All the best,

Michael Foord

On 17 Jun 2013, at 22:54, Ezio Melotti <ezio.melotti at gmail.com> wrote:

> Hi,
> are there any plans about doing a language summit at EuroPython this year?
> 
> Best Regards,
> Ezio Melotti
> _______________________________________________
> python-committers mailing list
> python-committers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-committers


--
http://www.voidspace.org.uk/


May you do good and not evil
May you find forgiveness for yourself and forgive others
May you share freely, never taking more than you give.
-- the sqlite blessing 
http://www.sqlite.org/different.html






From eliben at gmail.com  Sat Jun 22 21:02:58 2013
From: eliben at gmail.com (Eli Bendersky)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 12:02:58 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
Message-ID: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're supposed
to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the impression that
it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests. But it seems that
there are developers who see it otherwise.

For example, Raymond's changeset 5accb0ac8bfb (which was reverted by
Benjamin today). Alas, Raymond did not explain the change even when
challenged by multiple other core devs. Changeset f1dc30a1be72, which he
committed today, also doesn't appear to belong in a bugfix branch.

It would be great if we could document this somewhere - the 2.7 branch is
not a usual bugfix-mode branch, I realize, and hence maybe there's some
special treatment it deserves.

Thanks in advance,
Eli
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From solipsis at pitrou.net  Sat Jun 22 21:11:13 2013
From: solipsis at pitrou.net (Antoine Pitrou)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 21:11:13 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1371928273.2660.1.camel@fsol>

Le samedi 22 juin 2013 ? 12:02 -0700, Eli Bendersky a ?crit :
> Hello,
> 
> 
> I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're
> supposed to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the
> impression that it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests.
> But it seems that there are developers who see it otherwise.

For me it's *definitely* bug fixes (and documentation and tests) only.
The amount of regressions we had in recent 2.7.x bug fix releases makes
me want to revert anything that doesn't fall in those categories :-)

Regards

Antoine.




From barry at python.org  Sat Jun 22 21:35:41 2013
From: barry at python.org (Barry Warsaw)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 15:35:41 -0400
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>

On Jun 22, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:

>I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're supposed
>to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the impression that
>it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests. But it seems that
>there are developers who see it otherwise.

Strongly agree.  One additional allowed category of changes are build system
fixes, e.g. so that 2.7 can still be built on newer versions of operating
systems it already supports.

>It would be great if we could document this somewhere - the 2.7 branch is
>not a usual bugfix-mode branch, I realize, and hence maybe there's some
>special treatment it deserves.

IMO, Benjamin being the 2.7 RM has ultimate[1] say in the matter.  I'm very
glad he's conservative in what he allows in the branch.

-Barry

[1] Well, maybe penultimate, but I wouldn't mind seeing the Mercurial
equivalent of a wrastlin' match between him and the BDFL. :)

From rdmurray at bitdance.com  Sat Jun 22 22:39:52 2013
From: rdmurray at bitdance.com (R. David Murray)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 16:39:52 -0400
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
Message-ID: <20130622203952.F1223250169@webabinitio.net>

On Sat, 22 Jun 2013 15:35:41 -0400, Barry Warsaw <barry at python.org> wrote:
> On Jun 22, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
> 
> >I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're supposed
> >to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the impression that
> >it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests. But it seems that
> >there are developers who see it otherwise.
> 
> Strongly agree.  One additional allowed category of changes are build system
> fixes, e.g. so that 2.7 can still be built on newer versions of operating
> systems it already supports.
> 
> >It would be great if we could document this somewhere - the 2.7 branch is
> >not a usual bugfix-mode branch, I realize, and hence maybe there's some
> >special treatment it deserves.
> 
> IMO, Benjamin being the 2.7 RM has ultimate[1] say in the matter.  I'm very
> glad he's conservative in what he allows in the branch.

My understanding is that there is an additional category that we allow
beyond what Barry mentioned:  things that add support for "stuff" that
is analogous to the build enhancements:  platform changes we really want
to support that are trivial to add.  The non-controversial example of
this is adding mime types.  The somewhat more controversial (but we've
done it, IIRC) is adding support for new browsers (ie: Chrome) to the
webbrowser module.

But IMO we should be considering the 2.7 branch to be starting to harden
into immobility at this point.  The bar for even bug fixes to be applied
to 2.7 should be higher than for 3.3, and should continue to get higher
still as time passes.

--David

From eliben at gmail.com  Sat Jun 22 23:49:37 2013
From: eliben at gmail.com (Eli Bendersky)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 14:49:37 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
Message-ID: <CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 12:35 PM, Barry Warsaw <barry at python.org> wrote:

> On Jun 22, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
>
> >I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're supposed
> >to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the impression that
> >it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests. But it seems that
> >there are developers who see it otherwise.
>
> Strongly agree.  One additional allowed category of changes are build
> system
> fixes, e.g. so that 2.7 can still be built on newer versions of operating
> systems it already supports.
>

Yes, this makes sense too.

In general there seems to be an agreement, so it would be great to document
in some place. Many years will pass before we have another "special"
release like Python 2.7, so it's worth spending an extra few minutes to
have this written down. PEP 404 seems to be a reasonable place - any
objections? Benjamin, what do you think?

Eli
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From guido at python.org  Sat Jun 22 23:57:09 2013
From: guido at python.org (Guido van Rossum)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 14:57:09 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
Message-ID: <CAP7+vJL=rAq8tY71P0gHxJ9ksVdeREpFEuHjBunt-vZ2cD+YqA@mail.gmail.com>

On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 12:35 PM, Barry Warsaw <barry at python.org> wrote:
> [1] Well, maybe penultimate, but I wouldn't mind seeing the Mercurial
> equivalent of a wrastlin' match between him and the BDFL. :)

You wouldn't see that this summer though -- I could just tackle him in
the office. :-)

-- 
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)

From anthonybaxter at gmail.com  Sun Jun 23 00:01:46 2013
From: anthonybaxter at gmail.com (Anthony Baxter)
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2013 08:01:46 +1000
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
	<CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CANxH2eSBAaEOyC4H1actyZ0mm4zW9K6L-ZhmGUSJ2+GY+terhg@mail.gmail.com>

Maybe time it so when we *would* have released a 2.8 (18 months or so after
2.7) is when it goes into critical/security fixes only?
On Jun 22, 2013 11:50 PM, "Eli Bendersky" <eliben at gmail.com> wrote:

>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 22, 2013 at 12:35 PM, Barry Warsaw <barry at python.org> wrote:
>
>> On Jun 22, 2013, at 12:02 PM, Eli Bendersky wrote:
>>
>> >I may be missing something, but do we have a policy of what we're
>> supposed
>> >to commit to the 2.7 branch at this point? I was under the impression
>> that
>> >it's only bug fixes, documentation, and maybe tests. But it seems that
>> >there are developers who see it otherwise.
>>
>> Strongly agree.  One additional allowed category of changes are build
>> system
>> fixes, e.g. so that 2.7 can still be built on newer versions of operating
>> systems it already supports.
>>
>
> Yes, this makes sense too.
>
> In general there seems to be an agreement, so it would be great to
> document in some place. Many years will pass before we have another
> "special" release like Python 2.7, so it's worth spending an extra few
> minutes to have this written down. PEP 404 seems to be a reasonable place -
> any objections? Benjamin, what do you think?
>
> Eli
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> python-committers mailing list
> python-committers at python.org
> http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-committers
>
>
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From benjamin at python.org  Sun Jun 23 04:56:27 2013
From: benjamin at python.org (Benjamin Peterson)
Date: Sat, 22 Jun 2013 19:56:27 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
	<CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAPZV6o_1D6mVKeFy+wMfcycL+C9=67RdaRPNTahMMpgxN2EP4Q@mail.gmail.com>

2013/6/22 Eli Bendersky <eliben at gmail.com>:
> Yes, this makes sense too.
>
> In general there seems to be an agreement, so it would be great to document
> in some place. Many years will pass before we have another "special" release
> like Python 2.7, so it's worth spending an extra few minutes to have this
> written down. PEP 404 seems to be a reasonable place - any objections?
> Benjamin, what do you think?

PEP 373 is better given in that it deals with 2.7 and not a
non-existent 2.8 release. :)

I agree not every theoretically applicable bugfix needs to land in
2.7. If it's been broken for all of the 2.x series, it probably
doesn't need to be fixed now. (The most important bugs to fix are the
ones we introduced in the last bugfix release.) I'm also open to and
have been open to build system changes that keep Python compiling even
though they can break things (see cross-compiling). Even limited
not-build system "features" like retrofitting bsddb so it could
compile with a non-ancient version of bsddb can be acceptable.



--
Regards,
Benjamin

From ncoghlan at gmail.com  Sun Jun 23 05:51:28 2013
From: ncoghlan at gmail.com (Nick Coghlan)
Date: Sun, 23 Jun 2013 13:51:28 +1000
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAPZV6o_1D6mVKeFy+wMfcycL+C9=67RdaRPNTahMMpgxN2EP4Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
	<CAF-Rda9Cxw0X-ToWdWm-cvsJSOi_zrDodjCFDjuXTePmvHR75Q@mail.gmail.com>
	<CAPZV6o_1D6mVKeFy+wMfcycL+C9=67RdaRPNTahMMpgxN2EP4Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADiSq7fDTFxyp9F+1vU-dAT23TRvXkdEZZNUp_a=xe--kO1CKw@mail.gmail.com>

On 23 June 2013 12:56, Benjamin Peterson <benjamin at python.org> wrote:
> 2013/6/22 Eli Bendersky <eliben at gmail.com>:
>> Yes, this makes sense too.
>>
>> In general there seems to be an agreement, so it would be great to document
>> in some place. Many years will pass before we have another "special" release
>> like Python 2.7, so it's worth spending an extra few minutes to have this
>> written down. PEP 404 seems to be a reasonable place - any objections?
>> Benjamin, what do you think?
>
> PEP 373 is better given in that it deals with 2.7 and not a
> non-existent 2.8 release. :)
>
> I agree not every theoretically applicable bugfix needs to land in
> 2.7. If it's been broken for all of the 2.x series, it probably
> doesn't need to be fixed now. (The most important bugs to fix are the
> ones we introduced in the last bugfix release.) I'm also open to and
> have been open to build system changes that keep Python compiling even
> though they can break things (see cross-compiling). Even limited
> not-build system "features" like retrofitting bsddb so it could
> compile with a non-ancient version of bsddb can be acceptable.

FWIW, this aligns with my understanding of the purpose of the extended
maintenance period for Python 2.7 - not so much that it receives "new"
bug fixes, but more that we ensure it keeps building and otherwise
working reliably as the wider technology ecosystem changes around it
(for example, the cross-compilation changes to help cope with the rise
of ARM systems, especially the Raspberry Pi).

Cheers,
Nick.

--
Nick Coghlan   |   ncoghlan at gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia

From jcea at jcea.es  Mon Jun 24 03:07:47 2013
From: jcea at jcea.es (Jesus Cea)
Date: Mon, 24 Jun 2013 03:07:47 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <20130622203952.F1223250169@webabinitio.net>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<20130622153541.40516e3b@anarchist>
	<20130622203952.F1223250169@webabinitio.net>
Message-ID: <51C79BE3.3090807@jcea.es>

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

On 22/06/13 22:39, R. David Murray wrote:
> My understanding is that there is an additional category that we
> allow beyond what Barry mentioned:  things that add support for
> "stuff" that is analogous to the build enhancements:  platform
> changes we really want to support that are trivial to add.  The
> non-controversial example of this is adding mime types.  The
> somewhat more controversial (but we've done it, IIRC) is adding
> support for new browsers (ie: Chrome) to the webbrowser module.

bsddb module was recently updated to compile against current Oracle
Berkeley DB releases.

http://bugs.python.org/issue17477

Oracle just released Berkeley DB 6.0.19... :-).

- -- 
Jes?s Cea Avi?n                         _/_/      _/_/_/        _/_/_/
jcea at jcea.es - http://www.jcea.es/     _/_/    _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/
Twitter: @jcea                        _/_/    _/_/          _/_/_/_/_/
jabber / xmpp:jcea at jabber.org  _/_/  _/_/    _/_/          _/_/  _/_/
"Things are not so easy"      _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/    _/_/  _/_/
"My name is Dump, Core Dump"   _/_/_/        _/_/_/      _/_/  _/_/
"El amor es poner tu felicidad en la felicidad de otro" - Leibniz
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From larry at hastings.org  Wed Jun 26 04:02:13 2013
From: larry at hastings.org (Larry Hastings)
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 21:02:13 -0500
Subject: [python-committers] Language Summit at EuroPython
In-Reply-To: <7B4EC6C3-95E8-479B-8EBB-E66AFFDA4999@voidspace.org.uk>
References: <CACBhJdHKGFTho4QNxp33B7sq70AQqcUxtfhBHcFAuJ0Xunmh8A@mail.gmail.com>
	<7B4EC6C3-95E8-479B-8EBB-E66AFFDA4999@voidspace.org.uk>
Message-ID: <51CA4BA5.9060104@hastings.org>

On 06/18/2013 09:09 AM, Michael Foord wrote:
> Hey Ezio,
>
> There are no plans that I'm aware of to have a language summit at EuroPython, sorry.

We didn't have one last year because nobody had anything to say.  If 
you're (gentle reader) going to be at EuroPython and think you have 
something that needs discussng, please feel free to email me.  If I get 
a lot of topics I'll inquire about getting a room set aside for a couple 
of hours.

Cheers,


//arry/
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From larry at hastings.org  Wed Jun 26 04:10:30 2013
From: larry at hastings.org (Larry Hastings)
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 21:10:30 -0500
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>



Everything I read in this thread says that 2.7 only gets bug fixes, and 
even at that it has to be a pretty bad bug.  (Benjamin: "If it's been 
broken for all of the 2.x series, it probably doesn't need to be fixed 
now.")  I don't see even mild dissent; the replies have been strongly 
unanimous.

Less than a day ago Benjamin relented on reverting Raymond's 
deque-block-size changeset.  He has since reapplied the change. 
Therefore as of now this change will go into 2.7.6.  Although it looks 
like a fine idea, AFAICT this is not a bug fix--unless a longstanding 
performance regression can be considered a bug fix. So I don't 
understand why this change was reapplied.

I'm not questioning the decision--I'm asking, what is the heuristic I 
can apply in the future to predict whether or not a change will be 
accepted into the 2.7 branch.  My current heuristic ("only bad bug 
fixes") seems to be on the fritz.


//arry/
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From ethan at stoneleaf.us  Wed Jun 26 06:43:56 2013
From: ethan at stoneleaf.us (Ethan Furman)
Date: Tue, 25 Jun 2013 21:43:56 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
Message-ID: <51CA718C.9090103@stoneleaf.us>

On 06/25/2013 07:10 PM, Larry Hastings wrote:
>
>
> Everything I read in this thread says that 2.7 only gets bug fixes, and even at that it has to be a pretty bad bug.
> (Benjamin: "If it's been broken for all of the 2.x series, it probably doesn't need to be fixed now.")  I don't see even
> mild dissent; the replies have been strongly unanimous.
>
> Less than a day ago Benjamin relented on reverting Raymond's deque-block-size changeset.  He has since reapplied the
> change. Therefore as of now this change will go into 2.7.6.  Although it looks like a fine idea, AFAICT this is not a
> bug fix--unless a longstanding performance regression can be considered a bug fix. So I don't understand why this change
> was reapplied.
>
> I'm not questioning the decision--I'm asking, what is the heuristic I can apply in the future to predict whether or not
> a change will be accepted into the 2.7 branch.  My current heuristic ("only bad bug fixes") seems to be on the fritz.

+1

--
~Ethan~

From mal at egenix.com  Wed Jun 26 10:50:59 2013
From: mal at egenix.com (M.-A. Lemburg)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 10:50:59 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
Message-ID: <51CAAB73.6010305@egenix.com>

On 26.06.2013 04:10, Larry Hastings wrote:
> 
> 
> Everything I read in this thread says that 2.7 only gets bug fixes, and even at that it has to be a
> pretty bad bug.  (Benjamin: "If it's been broken for all of the 2.x series, it probably doesn't need
> to be fixed now.")  I don't see even mild dissent; the replies have been strongly unanimous.
> 
> Less than a day ago Benjamin relented on reverting Raymond's deque-block-size changeset.  He has
> since reapplied the change.  Therefore as of now this change will go into 2.7.6.  Although it looks
> like a fine idea, AFAICT this is not a bug fix--unless a longstanding performance regression can be
> considered a bug fix.  So I don't understand why this change was reapplied.
> 
> I'm not questioning the decision--I'm asking, what is the heuristic I can apply in the future to
> predict whether or not a change will be accepted into the 2.7 branch.  My current heuristic ("only
> bad bug fixes") seems to be on the fritz.

Let's not forget that Python 2.7 is the currently most used
Python version there is. It's being used in production and many
people rely on it.

I think that bug fixes (including fixes for performance regressions)
should continue to go into the 2.7 branch, as well as fixes that
allow compiling Python 2.7 on more recent platforms.

The current schedule is to provide bug fix releases at least
until 2015:

http://www.python.org/download/releases/2.7/
http://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0373/

Given that the transition to Python 3 is just starting to pick
up speed this year, we may have to revisit the 2015 end-of-support
next year.

-- 
Marc-Andre Lemburg
eGenix.com

Professional Python Services directly from the Source  (#1, Jun 26 2013)
>>> Python Projects, Consulting and Support ...   http://www.egenix.com/
>>> mxODBC.Zope/Plone.Database.Adapter ...       http://zope.egenix.com/
>>> mxODBC, mxDateTime, mxTextTools ...        http://python.egenix.com/
________________________________________________________________________
2013-06-18: Released mxODBC Django DE 1.2.0 ...   http://egenix.com/go47
2013-07-01: EuroPython 2013, Florence, Italy ...            5 days to go
2013-07-16: Python Meeting Duesseldorf ...                 20 days to go

   eGenix.com Software, Skills and Services GmbH  Pastor-Loeh-Str.48
    D-40764 Langenfeld, Germany. CEO Dipl.-Math. Marc-Andre Lemburg
           Registered at Amtsgericht Duesseldorf: HRB 46611
               http://www.egenix.com/company/contact/

From benjamin at python.org  Thu Jun 27 02:14:32 2013
From: benjamin at python.org (Benjamin Peterson)
Date: Wed, 26 Jun 2013 17:14:32 -0700
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
Message-ID: <CAPZV6o-T_h1AX_iW0M5ksn8f2wR1XwTuSg_bxw5RSeAuNxipSA@mail.gmail.com>

2013/6/25 Larry Hastings <larry at hastings.org>:
> I'm not questioning the decision--I'm asking, what is the heuristic I can
> apply in the future to predict whether or not a change will be accepted into
> the 2.7 branch.  My current heuristic ("only bad bug fixes") seems to be on
> the fritz.

I realize everyone wants a nice heuristic. Unfortunately, I don't
think one exists that explains why every change does or does not land
in 2.7.



--
Regards,
Benjamin

From ncoghlan at gmail.com  Thu Jun 27 10:52:36 2013
From: ncoghlan at gmail.com (Nick Coghlan)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 18:52:36 +1000
Subject: [python-committers] Policy for committing to 2.7
In-Reply-To: <CAPZV6o-T_h1AX_iW0M5ksn8f2wR1XwTuSg_bxw5RSeAuNxipSA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAF-Rda8N-T1V0J-vBUO-_EgULuh25B20UAVQWwH0mKcgBPn1iQ@mail.gmail.com>
	<51CA4D96.1020307@hastings.org>
	<CAPZV6o-T_h1AX_iW0M5ksn8f2wR1XwTuSg_bxw5RSeAuNxipSA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADiSq7c0B8YNTLzfiCL8jbFnw=oHkZyjHteOt1PvoMU7nxKNqg@mail.gmail.com>

On 27 June 2013 10:14, Benjamin Peterson <benjamin at python.org> wrote:
> 2013/6/25 Larry Hastings <larry at hastings.org>:
>> I'm not questioning the decision--I'm asking, what is the heuristic I can
>> apply in the future to predict whether or not a change will be accepted into
>> the 2.7 branch.  My current heuristic ("only bad bug fixes") seems to be on
>> the fritz.
>
> I realize everyone wants a nice heuristic. Unfortunately, I don't
> think one exists that explains why every change does or does not land
> in 2.7.

The best one I have is that simplifying cross-version maintenance and
addressing issues that arise due to changes in the underlying
platforms seem to be the two main reasons we do it :)

Cheers,
Nick.

--
Nick Coghlan   |   ncoghlan at gmail.com   |   Brisbane, Australia

From ezio.melotti at gmail.com  Thu Jun 27 20:16:08 2013
From: ezio.melotti at gmail.com (Ezio Melotti)
Date: Thu, 27 Jun 2013 20:16:08 +0200
Subject: [python-committers] Language Summit at EuroPython
In-Reply-To: <51CA4BA5.9060104@hastings.org>
References: <CACBhJdHKGFTho4QNxp33B7sq70AQqcUxtfhBHcFAuJ0Xunmh8A@mail.gmail.com>
	<7B4EC6C3-95E8-479B-8EBB-E66AFFDA4999@voidspace.org.uk>
	<51CA4BA5.9060104@hastings.org>
Message-ID: <CACBhJdG_Gk77PjuOgYjPWdf=7338Pi-cUj=XpzKmJKzeXtci6A@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

On Wed, Jun 26, 2013 at 4:02 AM, Larry Hastings <larry at hastings.org> wrote:
>
> We didn't have one last year because nobody had anything to say.

OK, I asked because the language summit usually happens the day before
the beginning of the conference, and I had/have to plan the travel.

>  If you're
> (gentle reader) going to be at EuroPython and think you have something that
> needs discussng, please feel free to email me.

I don't have any outstanding issues I need to discuss about, even
though I would still like to get the regex module included in 3.4.
This can probably be discussed informally during the conference if
someone is interested.

Best Regards,
Ezio Melotti

>  If I get a lot of topics
> I'll inquire about getting a room set aside for a couple of hours.
>
> Cheers,
>
>
> /arry