[Python-Dev] Re: Stability and change

Jeremy Hylton jeremy@zope.com
Wed, 10 Apr 2002 18:47:13 -0400

>>>>> "SM" == Skip Montanaro <skip@pobox.com> writes:

  SM> I think I need to write a PEP.

Everyone needs to write a PEP, just ask Raymond Hettinger.

  SM> There is perception and there is reality.  I believe the reality
  SM> is that Python is pretty stable.  There seems to be a perception
  SM> outside of the python-dev community that it is not.  In large
  SM> measure this thread has been more about what to do about
  SM> perceived instability than actual instability.

I agree.

  SM> You need to make measurements that demonstrate to people that
  SM> your code base is getting more stable, if only for PR purposes.

I think this is the crux of your argument, and the part I have
overlooked.  It doesn't matter if we make a release or I call my
grandmother and chat.  We just need a regular measurement interval.
Then we can say: "We fixed 16 bugs since Jeremy last talked to
Grannie."  Or since we made a release, or whatever. <wink>

  SM> Associating those metrics with specific release points would, I
  SM> think, provide more confidence in those numbers.  It's cheap to
  SM> add a new tag to CVS.


  SM> Even if not a single soul downloads and builds a particular
  SM> snapshot, creating such snapshots helps because they provide you
  SM> with static points in the CVS repository from which to make
  SM> measurements.

We could just use a snapshot generated by date In fact, there's a cron
job on SF that generates a nightly tarball.  I'll bet no one has ever
downloaded one.

  SM> I'm not suggesting that PythonLabs take on the extra burden of
  SM> making a bug of measurements.  Just provide the tickmarks for
  SM> the graph.

I don't see any value to producing more tarballs or tags or releases
in order to mark the occasion of measuring progress on fixing bugs.
Just make the measurement.

BTW, what measurements are you proposing to make?  How will you make
them?  What will they tell us?