[Python-Dev] A test case for what's missing in Python 3 (Re: RFC: PEP 460: Add bytes % args and bytes.format(args) to Python 3.5)

Barry Warsaw barry at python.org
Thu Jan 9 18:36:37 CET 2014

(Resending with an adjusted Subject and not through Gmane.  Apologies for

On Jan 08, 2014, at 01:51 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:

>Benjamin Peterson writes:
> > I agree. This is a very important, much-requested feature for low-level
> > networking code.
>I hear it's much-requested, but is there any description of typical
>use cases?

The two unported libraries that are preventing me from switching Mailman 3 to
Python 3 are restish and storm.  For storm, there's a viable alternative in
SQLAlchemy though I haven't looked at how difficult it will be to port the
model layer (even though we once did use SA).

restish is tougher.  I've investigated flask, pecan, wsme, and a few others
that already have Python 3 support and none of them provide an API that I
consider as nice a fit as restish for our standalone WSGI-based REST admin
server.  That's not to denigrate those other projects, it's just that I think
restish hit the sweet spot, and porting Mailman 3 to some other framework so
far has proven unworkable (I've tried with each of them).

restish is plumbing so I think it's a good test case for Nick's observations
of a wire-protocol layer library, and it's obvious that it Just Works in
Python 2 but does work at all in Python 3.  There have been at least 3
attempts to port restish to Python 3 and all of them get stuck in various
places where you actually *can't* decide whether some data structure should be
a bytes or str.  Make one choice and you get stuck over here, make the other
chose and you get stuck over there.

I've got two abandoned branches on github with (rather old) porting attempts,
and I know other developers have some branches as well.  Having given up on
trying to switch to a different framework, I'm starting over again with
restish (really, it's wonderful :).

I plan on keeping more detailed notes this time specifically so that I can
help contribute to this discussion.  If anybody wants to pitch in, both for
the specific purpose of porting the library, and for the more general insights
it could provide for this thread, please get in touch.

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