[Python-Dev] Python 2.7 patch levels turning two digit

[Donald Stufft]

On Jun 23, 2014, at 3:27 PM, M.-A. Lemburg <mal at egenix.com> wrote:

> On 23.06.2014 18:09, Donald Stufft wrote:
>> 
>> On Jun 23, 2014, at 2:09 AM, Martin v. Löwis <martin at v.loewis.de> wrote:
>> 
>>>> 
>>>> * Should we make use of the potential breakage with 2.7.10
>>>>  to introduce a new Windows compiler version for Python 2.7 ?
>>> 
>>> Assuming it is a good idea to continue producing Windows binaries
>>> for 2.7, I think it would be a bad idea to switch compilers. It will
>>> cause severe breakage of 2.7 installations, much more problematic
>>> than switching to two-digit version numbers.
>> 
>> I agree with this, we’ve just finally started getting things to the point where
>> it makes a lot of sense for binary distributions for Windows. Breaking all
>> of them on 2.7 would be very bad.

Err, sorry that “We” was with my pip hat on.

> 
> Not sure what you mean. We've had binary wininst distributions
> for Windows for more than a decade, and egg and msi distributions
> for 8 years :-)

Nonetheless, changing the compiler will not only break pip, but every
automated installer tool (easy_install, buildout) that i’m aware of. The
blow back for binary installation is going to be huge I think.

> 
> But without access to the VS 2008 compiler that is needed to
> compile those extensions, it will become increasingly difficult
> for package authors to provide such binary packages, so we have to
> ask ourselves:
> 
> What's worse: breaking old Windows binaries for Python 2.7
> or not having updated and new Windows binaries for Python 2.7
> at all in a few years ?

At the risk of getting Guido to post his slide again, I still think the
solution to the old compiler is to just roll a 2.8 with minimal changes.
It could even be a good place to move to the ssl backport changes
too since they were the riskier set of changes in PEP466.

But either way, if a compiler does change in a 2.7 release we’ll need
to update a lot of tooling to cope with that, so any plan to do that should
include that and a timeline for adoption of that.

> 
> Switching to a newer compiler will make things easier for everyone
> and we'd see more binary packages for Windows again.
> 
> Given that Python 2.7 support was extended for another 5 years at the
> recent Python Language Summit to 2020, we have to face this
> breakage sooner or later anyway. Extended support for VS 2008
> will end in 2018 (but then: Python developers usually don't have
> extended support contracts with MS). Service pack support has already
> ended in 2009.
> 
> Depending on how you see it, using such an old compiler also
> poses security risks. The last security update for VS 2008 dates
> back to 2011 (http://support.microsoft.com/kb/2538243).
> 
> -- 
> Marc-Andre Lemburg
> eGenix.com
> 
> Professional Python Services directly from the Source  (#1, Jun 23 2014)
>>>> Python Projects, Consulting and Support ...   http://www.egenix.com/
>>>> mxODBC.Zope/Plone.Database.Adapter ...       http://zope.egenix.com/
>>>> mxODBC, mxDateTime, mxTextTools ...        http://python.egenix.com/
> ________________________________________________________________________
> 2014-06-17: Released eGenix PyRun 2.0.0 ...       http://egenix.com/go58
> 2014-07-02: Python Meeting Duesseldorf ...                  9 days to go
> 2014-07-21: EuroPython 2014, Berlin, Germany ...           28 days to go
> 
>   eGenix.com Software, Skills and Services GmbH  Pastor-Loeh-Str.48
>    D-40764 Langenfeld, Germany. CEO Dipl.-Math. Marc-Andre Lemburg
>           Registered at Amtsgericht Duesseldorf: HRB 46611
>               http://www.egenix.com/company/contact/


-----------------
Donald Stufft
PGP: 0x6E3CBCE93372DCFA // 7C6B 7C5D 5E2B 6356 A926 F04F 6E3C BCE9 3372 DCFA

-------------- next part --------------
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: signature.asc
Type: application/pgp-signature
Size: 801 bytes
Desc: Message signed with OpenPGP using GPGMail
URL: <http://mail.python.org/pipermail/python-dev/attachments/20140623/d3dd7382/attachment.sig>