[Python-ideas] stdlib crowdsourcing

Mike Meyer mwm at mired.org
Tue Jun 12 18:51:47 CEST 2012

On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 12:04:58 +0300
anatoly techtonik <techtonik at gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Jun 2, 2012 at 8:24 PM, Calvin Spealman <ironfroggy at gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Fri, Jun 1, 2012 at 11:08 AM, anatoly techtonik <techtonik at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> On Tue, May 29, 2012 at 9:02 AM, Nick Coghlan <ncoghlan at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>> Once again, you're completely ignoring all existing knowledge and
> >>> expertise on open collaboration and trying to reinvent the world. It's
> >>> *not going to happen*.
> >> It's too boring to live in a world of existing knowledge and
> >> expertise,
> > Frankly, this one fragment is enough to stop me reading further. Who
> > wants to learn
> > from the vast and broad experience when you could simply randomize the rules of
> > reality through ignorance and stubbornness?
> If everybody would think like this, the world will never learn about
> anti-patterns, and the software craftmanship collapsed in astonishing
> agony some years ago. If it doesn't make it clear - it is not
> randomizing - it is putting beliefs to the test asking for the current
> status.

Ah, I think I see Anatoly's problem here. It's an impedance
mismatch. He wants to discuss language/platform/environment
ideas. This is valuable work, and he does have some interesting
ideas. It definitely has a place in the world.

It's just that this isn't that place. Python has a set of objectives
for the language that have been around long enough to qualify as
"traditions". As such, it's not a good place to experiment with
arbitrary changes to things, because you keep running afoul of the

> Common guys, what's wrong with you? It is just an idea, not a proposal
> or scientific paper.

Yes, but it's an idea that ignores the traditions of the environment
you're proposing it for. If you're serious about discussing ideas
about changing Python, you need to do the groundwork of understanding
those traditions, and try and make sure your ideas don't collide with
them. It doesn't matter whether or not they're good ideas, if they
clash with the traditions, they aren't going to happen. You need to
figure that out yourself, and not ask us to do it for you.

If, on the other hand, you want to talk about
language/platform/environment design ideas without that restriction,
then you need a different forum. Just because you happen to be working
in Python doesn't mean that a Python forum is appropriate for them,
any more than discussing (say) drone control programs would be
appropriate in a Python forum just because I happen to be writing it
in Python.

If you're somewhere in between the two, maybe a PyPy forum would be
more appropriate? I dunno. I'm sorry I can't really recommend a good
forum for you. The last time I was seriously interested in such
things, Python hadn't been released yet.

Mike Meyer <mwm at mired.org>		http://www.mired.org/
Independent Software developer/SCM consultant, email for more information.

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