[Python-ideas] One way to do format and print

Sven R. Kunze srkunze at mail.de
Thu Sep 10 19:43:40 CEST 2015

Of course I would not want to force you, Rob.

I believe in progress and progress is achieved through change. So, the 
best method for change I know of are deprecations: not all changes come 
bundled but singly and with time to prepare.

To me, it's just a minor deficiency in Python's own vision.


On 10.09.2015 01:32, Rob Cliffe wrote:
> I use %-formatting.
> Not because I think it's so wonderful and solves all problems 
> (although it's pretty good), but because it appeared to be the 
> recommended method at the time I learned Python in earnest.  If I were 
> only learning Python now, I would probably learn str.format or 
> whatever it is.
> I *could* learn to use something else *and* change all my working 
> code, but do you really want to force me to do that?
> I would guess that there are quite a lot of Python users in the same 
> position.
> Rob Cliffe
> On 09/09/2015 17:05, Sven R. Kunze wrote:
>> On 09.09.2015 02:09, Andrew Barnert via Python-ideas wrote:
>>> I think it's already been established why % formatting is not going 
>>> away any time soon.
>>> As for de-emphasizing it, I think that's already done pretty well in 
>>> the current docs. The tutorial has a nice long introduction to 
>>> str.format, a one-paragraph section on "old string formatting" with 
>>> a single %5.3f example, and a one-sentence mention of Template. The 
>>> stdtypes chapter in the library reference explains the difference 
>>> between the two in a way that makes format sound more attractive for 
>>> novices, and then has details on each one as appropriate. What else 
>>> should be done?
>> I had difficulties to find what you mean by tutorial. But hey, being 
>> a Python user for years and not knowing where the official tutorial 
>> resides...
>> Anyway, Google presented me the version 2.7 of the tutorial. Thus, 
>> the link to the stdtypes documentation does not exhibit the note of, 
>> say, 3.5:
>> "Note: The formatting operations described here exhibit a variety of 
>> quirks that lead to a number of common errors (such as failing to 
>> display tuples and dictionaries correctly). Using the newer 
>> str.format() interface helps avoid these errors, and also provides a 
>> generally more powerful, flexible and extensible approach to 
>> formatting text."
>> So, adding it to the 2.7 docs would be a start.
>> I still don't understand what's wrong with deprecating %, but okay. I 
>> think f-strings will push {} to wide-range adoption.
>> Best,
>> Sven
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