mod_perl and mod_python, is perl better for that task?

maxm maxm at normik.dk
Wed Mar 22 04:07:26 EST 2000


> [mailto:python-list-admin at python.org]On Behalf Of Kendall Clark

>     Pedro> Really, could mod_python be as good as mod_perl? There are
>     Pedro> more than 400000 site running mod_perl, including sites
>     Pedro> with huge traffic like slashdot or imdb. PyApache and
>     Pedro> Httpdapy don't seem to be causing much of enthusiasm in
>     Pedro> Pythonland. Why? If mod_python could be as good as mod_perl
>     Pedro> I think there would be few reasons to use perl.

Well there is probably a lot more people using Perl than Python. Probably a
testament to the brand of Perl. Even in Open Source "marketing" is
important. Besides ... mod_perl is practically all they got. Python has a
lot more options (Zope etc.).

A language like PHP is really nice and extremely qick to use for web
devbelopment. But any language will at some point need the features of
Python for making big Apps. Then php users will get into problems with their
language.

Besides that PHP is confined to Apache and cannot be used in the IIS, which
a lot of our  customers use.

> I think the lack of enthusiasm is because Zope is a lodestone. It
> deserves the attention and free, community development it gets, but it
> would be a shame, and a detriment to Python long-term, if it
> effectively squeezes everything else out of this space. It's good
> stuff but it's not perfect for *every* Web application need.

The main problem with Zope is the STEEP learning curve. To get more people
to use it, it has to be easier to get into. IMHO dtml is absolutely the
wrong aproach. I want Python in my pages as a scripting language. I don't
want to learn a new (bastard) language to use my Python modules.

The succes of php is probably a testament to the fact that others see it
that way to.

Well actually the whole idea of mixing html and code is a terrible idea, but
most newbies find it natural and they have to find out for themself that
it's a bad idea. What is needed is a tool that can start out that way, but
can also be used as pure code, when that level of enlighment has been
reached. Zope can do this, but it is way to difficult. You have to use a
"product" to implement new functionality which is a real pain when you could
just use a Python module.

If you just want to use a single python function on a page, you have tweak
all kinds of settings to get it in to you page. A bother for something that
really should, and can be, simple.

Perhaps I am wrong about Zope, but that shows another problem with it ...
really poor documentation.

What we need is probably something like PHP but with Python as the scripting
language. Python in asp on IIS does this. Apache needs it. I have no idea
how difficult it would be to implement though. I don't do c, only scripting
languages like Python, PHP, Jscrip, VBScript etc.

And then we need a bunch of implemented design patterns as modules to use on
all platforms. This would benefit both zope and other projects too. and
could make Python a killer webserver language.

If anybody would implement the mod_python that worked on the apache, I would
be all over it doing patterns in Python. Until then I do it on the IIS.

Max M

------------------------------------------------------------------------
Max M Rasmussen,   New Media Director    http://www.normik.dk   Denmark
e-mail  mailto:maxm at normik.dk    private mailto:maxmcorp at worldonline.dk






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