Could Python supplant Java?

ET etodd at msn.com
Thu Aug 22 15:46:04 CEST 2002


"goose" <spammenotguse at hobbiton.org> wrote in message
news:3D64C2F4.2030505 at hobbiton.org...
> ET wrote:
> > "goose" <spammenotguse at hobbiton.org> wrote in message
> > news:3D640BCE.4090201 at hobbiton.org...
> >
> >>Dan Johnson wrote:
> >><snip>
> >>
> >>>Serious question:
> >>>
> >>>What is so developer-hostile about Windows?
> >>>
> >>
> >>Serious Answer(tm):
> >>1. No development tools come installed with it. Without
> >>even a single compiler, how does a "developer" develop ?
> >>The result is usually to download/purchase a development
> >>tool.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Actually, there are developer tools that come with Windows.
>
> name one that comes with windows.

There actually are several.  You probably though haven't a clue about how to
use them since they aren't your *precious* C compiler.

>
> > Your statement
> > clearly indicates that you haven't a clue about what you are talking
about.
> > Of course, your comment implies that there aren't any free tools that
you
> > can get either - often times the same as what you find on those *nix
boxes.
>
> my comment does nothing of the sort ... read again and you'll find the
> word "download"
>

So unless it comes on already on the system that doesn't count???  You mean
the ONLY valid way to distribute components of an OS is if they are
installed originally when the OS is installed?  Downloading from the freely
available and secure source afterwards doesn't count?

> >
> >
> >>2. No proper scripting environment to do nightly
> >>build & test cycles (cron'd to run at midnight).
> >
> >
> > Gee, guess the scheduler and such are all in my imagination.   Ever
tried
> > the AT command?  No, didn't think so.
>
> there IS a scheduler, I never said that there wasn't, however
> there is NO scripting (read the above again, the word is *script*)
> facility
>

Guess you never heard of batch files then.  But in any event, if you need a
more powerful and "full" programming and scripting language, then use WSH -
it does come with the OS.

> >
> >
> >>(IDE's are nice if you're gonna sit at your desk and click
> >>on the buttons, but on a 20 person project, I want to be
> >>able to get everyone to save their work to a server, and
> >>have *everything* recompiled from scratch, so that if
> >>anyone made a change that broke someone else component, we'd
> >>find out the next morning, not six weeks later when we are
> >>trying to integrate our code together). The lack of a system
> >>provided make utility is depressing.
> >>
> >
> >
> > And the lack of your having even basic knowledge of Windows is pathetic
> > given your attacks against it.
>
> what attack ?
>
> >
> >
> >>3. The inability to easily let everyone use *the* *same* *machine*
> >>to compile, all at the same time (via an ssh shell, or an xterm
> >>if the developer likes GUI IDE's). This way it is possible to make
> >>sure that no developer is using a compiler which could possibly
> >>be patched to a different version than the others (autoupdate?).
> >>
> >
> >
> > Gee, you don't know how to do this on Windows?   Again, you demonstrate
your
> > ignorance.   Of course, alternatively, you could be smart and have the
dev
> > environment installed to a shared location so that there is only the one
> > version that has to be managed and you wouldn't have everyone constantly
> > stepping on each other's development process.
> >

What??? No response?

> >
> >>4. The lack of a single decent editor ... 'nuff said.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Yes, the hundreds of editors that are available for Windows does add
what
> > would appear to be too much flexibility and capability for you to
handle.
> > Since you clearly don't know Windows, you clearly don't even know about
the
> > programming editors included either.
>
> windows does NOT come with a decent editor

Actually it comes with several - can you figure out what they are?

>
> >
> >
> >>Basicly, after you jump the flaming hoops to install your OS,
> >>it is frustrating to sit in front of it without being able to
> >>write a single line of code because the OS assumes that the
> >>person using it is not a developer. No other system that I've
> >>installed has this "feature" ... the first thing I do after an
> >>installation is run 'cc -v' ... and everthing from linux to
> >>sco to solaris to iris allows me to start writing code.
> >>
> >
> >
> > The difference is that those other systems are practically useless for
work
> > without the constant need to compile your own stuff.
>
> no
>
> > On Windows, the apps
> > to do what you want already exist in binary form and don't need to be
> > re-compiled locally in order to run.
>
> the issue is that there are no development tools
>
> > But you knew that.  Of course, if all
> > you want is a compiler, there are many available for free - even some
from
> > MS.
>
> but windows does not come with any development tools

Ah, but it DOES!  Just because you don't know what they are since they
aren't your precious C compiler doesn't mean they don't exist.

>
>
> >
> >
> >>Windows lets me play solitaire :-(
> >>
> >
> >
> > Sure that's not too much for you to handle?
>
> windows does not come with any development tools

Sure it does - again, you don't know what you are talking about.

>
> >
> >
> >>>Are you sure it isn't really Microsoft you find.. hostile? :D
> >>
> >>no, I can stand solitaire for a few minutes while my
> >>development tools load :-)
> >>
> >
> >
> > *few minutes*????  Guess you must be using one of those overpriced but
slow
> > *nix boxes if it takes that long.
> >
>
> windows does not come with *ANY* development tools

You mean that it doesn't come with your *precious* C compiler.

>
> (are you sure you understood what point I was trying to make ? if you
> did not, then let me try again
> "windows does not come with any development tools, the tools are
> available seperately"
>
> there ... do you understand what I was trying to say ?
>
> --
> goose
> ruse at webmail dot co dot za
>

Do you understand what I am saying - some development tools ARE available on
the install CD and many more are available as free downloads from MS and
others.

--ET--





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