Low level python

[Ken Seehof]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: python-list-admin at python.org
> [mailto:python-list-admin at python.org]On Behalf Of Gustavo Cordova
> Sent: Friday, May 03, 2002 7:23 AM
> To: Python List
> Subject: RE: Low level python
> 
> 
> > > I've been thinking of writing a device driver in python.
> > > 
> > > Some people say this is ridiculous.
> > > 
> > > I used psyco to improve the speed, and now have a program 
> > > that does the device driver's job (a proprietry touchscreen
> > > driver) in user mode.
> > > 
> > > Now, I have no idea how to make the python exe or dll run in 
> > > kernel mode. I wonder if there are some special api calls
> > > that need to made.
> > > 
> > > I'm downloading WinDriver. I hope this can help me.
> > > 
> > > Does anyone not think this is a crazy thing to do?
> > > 
> > > Why not use python for a device driver?
> > > 
> > > I just see it as python dll is the driver, and the .py file are like
> > > permanent configuration file for it.
> > > 
> > > Comments Appreciated
> > > Matthew Sherborne
> > 
> > I think it's a fabulous idea.  I think you will find yourself writing
> > a few python extensions, so be prepared.
> > 
> > Perhaps even a python operating system is plausable.  I'm not very
> > knowledgeable about operating system design, but it seems as if
> > some operating systems such as Windows suffer from a lack of a robust
> > universal object model with garbage collection.  The idea would be
> > to expose the kernel and low level interfaces as python extensions.
> > As processors continue to move into the GHz zone, function call
> > overhead becomes less significant, while scaleability and code
> > complexity become more significant.
> > 
> > Well, now maybe people will call me crazy instead of you :-)
> > 
> > - Ken
> > 
> 
> This is a *very* interesting project, and mightily seductive,
> intellectually speaking.
> 
> BUT, one thing I differ in respect to the opinions expressed
> by many of the folx here, is that 3mb for a device driver
> seems to me awfully expensive --memory wise--, and, dangerous.
> 
> Dangerous, because there is lots of code which can hide bugs
> in 3 Mb. Bugs which could, at the device-driver level, wipe out
> the whole work of months, in a blink. We've all had our share
> of flaky windows (3.x, 95, 98, NT, etc) drivers, and the heartache
> and pain they cause (and lost time, and bloo screens of deth).
> 
> Do we really want that for our Python-written drivers? Is that
> the reputation we wish to create?
> 
> Wait a sec, I'm not saying that Python may be flaky, on the
> contrary, it's proven itself more than once, and the quality of
> the PEOPLE behind it's development is superb. But mistakes are
> maken, nobody's perfect.
> 
> That's what makes a driver written in C or in assembler (better
> yet) such a beautiful thing: it's tiny, it ONLY uses what you
> explicitly told it to use, and it's fast.
> 
> OK, after having my say about "the water's cold and you'll catch
> your death", let's jump in the pool. :-)
> 
> Call me old fashioned ("booo!! hisss!! oldster!!!"), but writing
> a device driver in an interpreted language doesn't really rub me
> the right way.
> 
> I was playign around a few months back with Forth, a really neato
> language, but even more illegible than Perl, if you can believe
> that. BUT, it's really really appealing to anybody's hacker
> instinct. Dangerously appealing, if you ask me.
> 
> One of the most neat things is that a complete Forth system,
> compiler and all, is very small, and it's written in Forth itself.
> Forth, written in Forth.
> 
> And, in a package I found, it comes with a machine language
> assembler. Now *that* would be useful for our python device drivers.
> A Machine Language Assembler module.
> 
> 
> from Assembler import Ix86
> 
> 
> So, you assemble a few instructions, which do all the low-level
> stuff you need, and very quickly. Bit-fiddling is best done in
> machine language.
> 
> Is this doable?
> 
> Can python eventually become self-hosting, like forth?
> 
> Can we do away with the C stdlib tyranny?
> 
> Can python eventually become it's own OS?
> 
> Sounds very interesting to find out.

I think you can probably get native assembly by using weave
http://www.scipy.org/site_content/weave

Just use inline assembly within the C code string.

- Ken