Do pythons like sugar?

Steve Holden sholden at
Thu Jan 9 16:08:06 CET 2003

"Andrew Bennetts" <andrew-pythonlist at> wrote in message
news:mailman.1042118119.29945.python-list at
> On Thu, Jan 09, 2003 at 12:54:24PM +0000, Afanasiy wrote:
> > On Thu, 9 Jan 2003 22:29:33 +1100, Andrew Bennetts
> > <andrew-pythonlist at> wrote:
> > >>
> > >> You don't know what I am doing. My design is perfect.
> > >
> > >What is good design for one language isn't necessarily good design for
> > >another.  Python offers different features to, say, C++, and is best
used in
> > >different ways.  I would recommend that you try to understand the
> > >world-view better, rather than insisting on imposing your
preconceptions on
> > >us... my experience agrees with Andrew Dalke's; explicit self is much
> > >than the alternatives.
> >
> > If the "pythonic world-view" is that code which would look better with
> > implicit self is "poor implementation", then no, I do not agree with it.
> The pythonic world-view on this particular issue is that "Explicit is
> than implicit", yes.
> > Please note I am not complaining out about the lack of this possibility.
> > I only have a problem with the condescending tones. I guess it's normal.
> In my experience, people who find this sort of thing about Python annoying
> aren't using Python optimally.  My recommendation is to trust us, show us
> your whole class, and invite constructive criticism on its design.  This
> sound condescending, but this newsgroup is filled with experienced Python
> programmers, and I would be very surprised if you considered yourself
> at writing Python than them.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if he considered himself better at writing
Python. I'd be surprised if he were right, though.

Afanasiy: to write '''If the "pythonic world-view" is that code which would
look better with implicit self is "poor implementation"''' and '''My design
is perfect.''', and then complain about condescending attitudes strikes me
as the pot calling the kettle black. You asked a question, and you got
answers. You may not have liked the tone, but since you can only *interpret*
its meaning it usually doesn't do you much good to complain about newsgroup
modes of expression. Or, more shortly: "get over it!".

This is actually quite a friendly group (certainly there are many others
where you would experience much greater hostility). Try not to interpret
comments as condescending: they usually aren't. I guess you may wish to make
an exception of this message :-), though I am actually trying to pur oil on
troubled waters.

Steve Holden                        
Python Web Programming       
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