Why don't people like lisp?

[Bjorn Pettersen]

"Marc Battyani" <Marc.Battyani at fractalconcept.com> wrote in
news:bnesv2$18i at library1.airnews.net: 

> "Bjorn Pettersen" <bjorn.pettersen at comcast.net> wrote
> 
>> The intertwined html/lisp example was laughable. What company would
>> let a programmer/engineer deal with trivialitites like changing style
>> guides, color schemes etc., which quite frankly they know nothing
>> about since they're not visual desingers? This is why the plethora of
>> templating systems exist -- and are the right tool for the job.
> 
> If plethora of templating systems exist, this only proves that it's
> the best system on average for average programmers on average cases.

No. Their abundance doesn't prove anything. It does perhaps indicate 
that they're useful.

> Now try to do a really complex web application (that is not some kind
> of eCommerce one but one with hundreds of classes with different views
> according to the habilitation levels, and objects status) and then you
> need an above average systems or the development time explodes.

AFAIK, this is true for any 'really complex' problem in any problem 
domain (and I can surely redefine 'really complex' to make it so no 
matter what you're currently using <wink>). The _overwhelming_ number of 
web projects are either trivially simple wrt user-interface, and even 
complex projects normally have simple UIs. If 'really complex' projects 
account for e.g. less than .5%, at least _I_ wouldn't feel comfortable 
saying that the html macros presented earlier will always provide a good 
solution -- and if not always, I'll have to write something new, further 
reducing the usability range...

> The designers' HTML is obviously always automatically converted to the
> equivalent Lisp code.

Hmm.. does the developer test the conversion + his additions on all 
browsers/platforms, or is it converted back to html for the visual 
designer to verify? How can you guarantee an exact roundtrip without 
implementing a template system? (think: someone added stuff -- let's say 
in the domain specific language you created for them -- to your Lisp 
program and re-indented to make it look better in their eyes, more like 
C... still works the same doesn't it? ;-)

> [Hum, sorry for being harsh but these kind of endless threads (a
> comp.lang.lisp specialty) get on my nerves. And now I'm even
> increasing the noise by posting to one of these. And yes I know, if I
> don't like them I don't have to read them. I don't, I just do some
> random sampling... :(] 

I should perhaps have removed c.l.py...

-- bjorn