PEP 3102 for review and comment

Russell E. Owen rowen at cesmail.net
Mon May 22 21:22:19 CEST 2006


In article <1148102845.438543.16380 at 38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
 "Talin" <viridia at gmail.com> wrote:

> (Note: PEPs in the 3xxx number range are intended for Python 3000,
> however this particular PEP may be backported if there is support for
> it.)
> 
> PEP: 3102
> Title: Keyword-Only Arguments
...
>     Syntactically, the proposed changes are fairly simple.  The first
>     change is to allow regular arguments to appear after a varargs
>     argument:
> 
>         def sortwords(*wordlist, case_sensitive=False):
>            ...
> 
>     This function accepts any number of positional arguments, and it
>     also accepts a keyword option called 'case_sensitive'.  This
>     option will never be filled in by a positional argument, but
>     must be explicitly specified by name.

The following is a 2nd syntactical change, and I strongly suggest 
listing it as such (since the first change can be made without this 
change):

>     Keyword-only arguments are not required to have a default value.
>     Since Python requires that all arguments be bound to a value,
>     and since the only way to bind a value to a keyword-only argument
>     is via keyword, such arguments are therefore 'required keyword'
>     arguments.  Such arguments must be supplied by the caller, and
>     they must be supplied via keyword.

...making this the third syntactical change:

>     The second syntactical change is to allow the argument name to
>     be omitted for a varargs argument. The meaning of this is to
>     allow for keyword-only arguments for functions that would not
>     otherwise take a varargs argument:
> 
>         def compare(a, b, *, key=None):

Personally, my feelings are:

+1 on allowing keyword arguments after *args. I have long wanted this 
and feel it is:
- very useful (the alternative of abusing **kargs is ugly and doesn't 
support introspection)
- an obvious and clear extension of current notation
- removes an awkward limitation of current notation

-1 on allowing keywords without values because:
- if it is added, then it means something like the last change is 
required, and as I say next, I don't like it
- why bother? it just makes work for the caller

-1 on the use of * to mean a separator between positional args and 
keyword-only args because:
- I think proposed syntax is confusing (there are more arguments in the 
argument list than the function accepts; yecch!!!) and hard to read
- I don't think the added functionality is important enough to justify 
the awkward notation

If folks are desperate enough for this last feature then please at least 
find a clearer notation. For example:
  def compare(a, b | key=None):
but personally I'd rather skip it.

Now if somebody could figure out a natural notation for boolean flags, 
*that'd* be useful (where the presence, absence or explicit negation of 
a keyword is all that is required to enable or disable a feature).

-- Russell



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