php vs python

Joel Koltner zapwireDASHgroups at
Wed Jun 4 22:20:16 CEST 2008

"Marc 'BlackJack' Rintsch" <bj_666 at> wrote in message 
news:6ak1pjF379qfdU2 at
> I think you are talking about something a little different than Arnaud.

Ah, OK.

> Other old habits from people coming to Python are: using indexes where they
> are not needed, trivial getters and setters, putting *everything* into
> classes and every class into a module, and so on.

Some of that is more political/policy than anything having to do with the 
language.  Python likes to make it blatantly obvious that a lot of it is 
unnecessary, so it puts the "control freak" type of programmers on the 
defensive when, e.g., class variables and methods aren't private by default. 
(Guido's "we're all conesenting adults here" is of course a good response to 

> Another difference are internal versus external iterators.  In Python you
> write the loop outside the iterable and pull the items out of it.  In
> other languages (Ruby, Io, .) iterables do internal iteration and you give
> them a function where all item are "pushed" into one at a time.

The Python method is -- IMO -- rather more powerful here, even if the whole 
protocol is somewhat less explciti than the Ruby/Io/etc. approach.

> What makes C++ a "first class" language?

My somewhat arbitrary definition is something along the lines of a language 
with most all of the "contemporary" features expected of languages (e.g., "old 
school" procedural languages like C/Pascal/Fortran 77 don't count) that are 
targeting at writing everything from small utilities to programs of various 
sizes to full-blown operating systems.

> And did you quote "first class"
> for the same reason than I did?  ;-)

Probably... C++ is kinda like the McMaster-Carr catalog, whereas Python is a 
well-stocked hardware store with knowledgable salespeople.


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