python tutorial

[Ethan Furman]

steve wrote:
> "Robert Kern" <robert.kern at gmail.com> wrote in message 
> news:mailman.1728.1245289092.8015.python-list at python.org...
> 
>>On 2009-06-17 19:36, steve wrote:
>>
>>>>"Carl Banks"<pavlovevidence at gmail.com>  wrote in message
>>>>news:2f6271b1-5ffa-4cec-81f8->>0276ad647026 at p5g2000pre.googlegroups.com...
>>>>On Jun 15, 7:56 pm, "steve"<st... at nospam.au>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>I was just looking at the python tutorial, and I noticed these lines:
>>>>>
>>>>>http://docs.python.org/tutorial/inputoutput.html#reading-and-writing-...
>>>>>
>>>>>"Windows makes a distinction between text and binary files;
>>>>>"the end-of-line characters in text files are automatically altered
>>>>>"slightly when data is read or written.
>>>>>
>>>>>I don't see any obvious way to at docs.python.org to get that 
>>>>>corrected:
>>>>>Is
>>>>>there some standard procedure?
>>>>
>>>>What's wrong with it?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Carl Banks
>>>
>>>1) Windows does not make a distinction between text and binary files.
>>>
>>>2) end-of-line characters in text files are not automatically altered by
>>>Windows.
>>
>>The Windows implementation of the C standard makes the distinction. E.g. 
>>using stdio to write out "foo\nbar\n" in a file opened in text mode will 
>>result in "foo\r\nbar\r\n" in the file. Reading such a file in text mode 
>>will result in "foo\nbar\n" in memory. Reading such a file in binary mode 
>>will result in "foo\r\nbar\r\n". In your bug report, you point out several 
>>proprietary APIs that do not make such a distinction, but that does not 
>>remove the implementations of the standard APIs that do make such a 
>>distinction.
>>
>>  http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/yeby3zcb.aspx
>>
>>Perhaps it's a bit dodgy to blame "Windows" per se rather than its C 
>>runtime, but I think it's a reasonable statement on the whole.
>>
>>-- 
>>Robert Kern
> 
> 
> 
> Which is where I came in: I was looking for simple file IO in the tutorial. 
> The tutorial tells me something false about Windows, rather than something 
> true about Python.
> 
> I'm looking at a statement that is clearly false (for anyone who knows 
> anything about Windows file systems and Windows file io), which leaves the 
> Python behaviour completely undefined (for anyone who knows nothing about 
> Python).
> 
> I understand that many of you don't really have any understanding of 
> Windows, much less any background with Windows, and I'm here to help.  That 
> part was simple.

I will freely admit to having no idea of just how many pythonastis have 
good Windows experience/background, but how about you give us the 
benefit of the doubt and tell us exactly which languages/routines you 
play with *in windows* that fail to make a distinction between text and 
binary?

> The next part is where I can't help: What is the behaviour of Python?
> 
> I'm sure you don't think that tutorial is only for readers who can guess 
> that they have to extrapolate from the behaviour of the Visual C library in 
> order to work out what Python does.
> 
> 
> Steve