How far can stack [LIFO] solve do automatic garbage collection and prevent memory leak ?

1001nuits 1001nuits at gmail.com
Sun Aug 22 23:40:55 CEST 2010


Le Sun, 22 Aug 2010 20:12:36 +0200, John Bokma <john at castleamber.com> a  
écrit:

> David Kastrup <dak at gnu.org> writes:
>
>> John Bokma <john at castleamber.com> writes:
>>
>>> David Kastrup <dak at gnu.org> writes:
>>>
>>>> John Passaniti <john.passaniti at gmail.com> writes:
>>>>
>>>>> Amen!  All this academic talk is useless.  Who cares about things  
>>>>> like
>>>>> the big-O notation for program complexity.  Can't people just *look*
>>>>> at code and see how complex it is?!  And take things like the years  
>>>>> of
>>>>> wasted effort computer scientists have put into taking data  
>>>>> structures
>>>>> (like hashes and various kinds of trees) and extending them along
>>>>> various problem domains and requirements.  Real programmers don't
>>>>> waste their time with learning that junk.  What good did any of that
>>>>> ever do anyone?!
>>>>
>>>> It is my experience that in particular graduated (and in particular  
>>>> Phd)
>>>> computer scientists don't waste their time _applying_ that junk.
>>>
>>> Question: do you have a degree in computer science?
>>>
>>> Since in my experience: people who talk about their experience with
>>> graduated people often missed the boat themselves and think that  
>>> reading
>>> a book or two equals years of study.
>>
>> I have a degree in electrical engineering.  But that's similarly
>> irrelevant.
>
> Nah, it's not: your attitude towards people with a degree in computer
> science agrees with what I wrote.
>
>> That has not particularly helped my respect towards CS majors and PhDs
>> in the function of programmers (and to be honest: their education is not
>> intended to make them good programmers, but to enable them to _lead_
>> good programmers).
>
> I disagree.
>
>> That does not mean that I am incapable of analyzing, say quicksort and
>> mergesort,
>
> Oh, that's what I was not implying. I am convinced that quite some
> people who do self-study can end up with better understanding of things
> than people who do it for a degree. I have done both: I already was
> programming in several languages before I was studying CS. And my
> experience is that a formal study in CS can't compare to home study
> unless you're really good and have the time and drive to read formal
> books written on CS. And my experience is that most self-educaters don't
> have that time.
>
> On the other hand: some people I knew during my studies had no problem
> at all with introducing countless memory leaks in small programs (and
> turning off compiler warnings, because it gave so much noise...)
>
>> Donald Knuth never studied computer science.
>
> Yes, yes, and Albert Einstein worked at an office.
>
> Those people are very rare.
>
> But my experience (see for plenty of examples: Slashdot) is that quite
> some people who don't have a degree think that all that formal education
> is just some paper pushing and doesn't count. While some of those who do
> have the paper think they know it all. Those people who are right in
> either group are a minority in my experience.
>
> As for electrical engineering: done that (BSc) and one of my class mates
> managed to connect a transformer the wrong way around.... twice. Yet he
> had the highest mark in our class.
>
> So in short: yes, self-study can make you good at something. But
> self-study IMO is not in general a replacement for a degree. Someone who
> can become great after self-study would excel at a formal study and
> learn more. Study works best if there is competition and if there are
> challenges. I still study a lot at home, but I do miss the challenges
> and competition.
>

Hi all,

I quite agree with the fact that self learning is not enough.

Another thing you learn in studying in University is the fact that you can  
be wrong, which is quite difficult to accept for self taught people. When  
you work in groups, you are bound to admit that you don't have the best  
solution all the time. To my experience, self-taught people I worked with  
had tremendous difficulties to accept that they were wrong, that their  
design was badly done, that their code was badly written or strangely  
designed.

Because self teaching was done with a lot of efforts, in particular to  
figure out complex problems on their own. Most of the time, the self  
learned people are attached to the things they learned by themselves and  
have difficulties to envisage that being right of wrong is often not an  
issue provided the group comes to the best option. They often live  
contradiction as a personal offense while it is just work, you know.

That's another interest of the degree, confrontation with other people  
that have the same background. And letting the things learned at the place  
they should be and not in the affective area.

1001




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