To whoever hacked into my Database

Antoon Pardon antoon.pardon at
Wed Nov 13 19:11:53 CET 2013

Op 13-11-13 15:10, Ian Kelly schreef:

>> Well you can expect all you want. It is not going to happen. Your
>> expectations are completely unrealistic and the way you react will
>> be perceived by a number of people as just an attempt to getting those
>> that are frustrated silenced without much care about what caused those
>> frustrations.
> There is absolutely nothing that I can do about what caused those
> frustrations, so what practical difference does it make whether I care
> or not?

If you want to persuade people to change their behaviour, it matters
very much if you can show them you care.

>> It looks like in your world you have a very limited idea of how adults
>> behave. Expecting the others to behave like adults has often enough
>> been the strategy of the priveledged to ignore justified frustration.
> Nobody is being disenfranchised here.  If you want to make this about
> privilege, then I will just say that I think it is the height of
> privilege to be fussing over the fact that there are people who annoy
> you on the internet, and moreover doing so to the detriment of the
> community.

Is it? Then why are you fussing here? Why don't you address the spoon
feeders who frustrate other group members to the detriment of the community.

>> It is a win either way. If the frustration is uttered in an adult,
>> mature way it doesn't cause much discomfort and is easily ignored. So
>> when those who are frustrated see that being adult and mature doesn't
>> get them much and start reacting a bit less adultly and maturely the
>> frustration can now be dismissed as not being done in an adult and
>> mature way.
>> That is your goal here too. You are not interested in the frustrations
>> of a number of people. You just want to be able to ignore there are
>> frustrated people on the news group.
> It's not about me at all.  If it were, I would be more likely to just
> unsubscribe than to raise a fuss about it.  It's also not about you,
> and it's not even about Nikos.  What it is about is that this crap
> about Nikos is often the first thing that newcomers will see when they
> join this group.

So? If this wasn't about you, this just wouldn't make a difference to

> You seem very concerned in your posts about what
> kind of message I'm sending by what I choose to respond to.

Just making sure you were aware of that aspect as the rest of your contribution
strongly suggested you were not.

> Well,
> think about what kind of message it sends to a new user when their
> introduction to the group -- which is supposedly about Python -- is a
> lot of flaming directed at some poster whom they know nothing about.

Well one message obviously is that it is possible to annoy the regulars to
the point that they start flaming you. I don't think that is bad.

> You keep trying to cast certain people who are frustrated by Nikos as
> victims in all this, but they're not.  I think that all who have
> posted in this thread, and many who haven't, are probably all
> frustrated in one way or another by all this -- I know that I
> certainly am.  The victims are the community as a whole, 

The community as a whole suffers when its members get frustrated and
one part of the community telling the other part to just deal with
it is no way to turn the community into something welcoming again and
is IMO more detrimental to the community than a number of people
venting their frustration.

You expect those that get frustrated to tolerate Nikos and to tolerate
the spoon feeding, but you are unable to tolerate the venting of

> and anybody
> who decides not to join because they see this fracas and decide to
> seek out a more inviting forum.

Why would they be a victim? What is there to be victim about seeking
out a more inviting forum? I also think you are confusing a welcome
community with a community without conflict.

> Here's my plea to everybody, in a nutshell.  Remember that the name of
> this group is comp.lang.python.  It's *not*

It is also not alt.misc.keep.spoon.feeding.nikos.

> The topic here is Python, and if
> you want to talk about that, then welcome and please do.  If on the
> other hand you just want to vent your frustration, then find somewhere
> else to do it.  Please.

But if you want to spoon feed a help vampire to the detriment of the
group you can go right ahead?

Antoon Pardon

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