[python-uk] easy_install pip won't work, am concerned Ministry of Packaging may chase after me.

Ed Stafford walter.stafford at carbonsixty.co.uk
Thu Apr 1 12:21:26 CEST 2010


Hello,

Without trying to argue about the purity of package managers or their uses I
would say that the reality is that there are some issues with dependable
python packages supplied for various distros. Because of that I always find
it easier to manage the necessary packages myself, that's all I was trying
to say. Sometimes it's just not worth the trouble of fighting a package
manager when you have something else that's completely workable and
reliable, e.g. pip/setup_tools and pypi. Even then we're sometimes forced to
develop against trunk for various projects, in which case you would still be
better off using something like pip.

The reason setup_tools was installed is because pip requires it to function
and I've never had any trouble using the bootstrap scripts then installing
pip via easy_install.

This has been my experience and your mileage may vary.

Cheers,
-Ed

On 1 April 2010 10:51, John Pinner <funthyme at gmail.com> wrote:

> HI,
>
> At the risk of repeating other (lengthy) discussions on this subject from
> 18 months ago...
>
> On 1 April 2010 02:39, Jon Ribbens <jon+python-uk at unequivocal.co.uk<jon%2Bpython-uk at unequivocal.co.uk>
> > wrote:
>
>> On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 10:14:50PM +0100, Ed Stafford wrote:
>> >    Mike,
>> >
>> >    Glad it worked for you. Although the Ubuntu team does a fine job of
>> >    package management I'm still a bit hesitant to use their python
>> packages.
>>
>
> The problem is that they're usually out-of-date. The same goes for debian
> whence Ubuntu obtain their packages.
>
> The advantage of using Ubuntu/Debian packages, where up-to-date ones exist,
> is that your system is under consistent control of the system's package
> manager.
>
>  >    It's easy enough using vanilla python to get everything you need
>> going.
>>
>
> The issue with using the Python utils is that they do not play with the
> distibution's package management. For example, they do not cooperate over
> dependencies, nor provide a clean uninstall. No self-respecting sysadmin
> would dream of using them, simply because they are independent of the
> system's package management ( eg apt or yum).
>
> In
>> >    the future you can do the following just as easily.
>> >
>> >    `wget [1]http://peak.telecommunity.com/dist/ez_setup.py`<http://peak.telecommunity.com/dist/ez_setup.py%60>
>> >    `sudo python ez_setup.py`
>> >    `sudo easy_install pip virtualenv virtualenvwrapper`
>>
>> I strongly advise not using easy_install, it's awful.
>>
>
> Yes, because it's trying to solve the problems of package management on
> systems without a'proper'  package manager, it compromises those systems
> with one.
>
> I think that the solution here is for the Python package maintainers to
> make sure that *they* provide the Debian/Ubuntu/Red Hat/SUSE/whatever
> packages, and not rely on the hard-pressed distribution maintainers.
>
> A kludge that I use is to download the Python package, eg xlwt, then do a
> setup.py build, and run alien on the resulting tar.gz to produce a .deb or
> .rpm. At least I get a package which can be installed/uninstalled by the
> system package manager, although Python dependencies will not be managed
> without a bit of tweaking.
>
> Best wishes,
>
> John
> --
>
>
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