[Pythonmac-SIG] needed: simple gui toolkit with "japaneseinput" support
Ronald Oussoren
ronaldoussoren at mac.com
Mon Apr 10 23:43:35 CEST 2006
On 10-apr-2006, at 23:21, Kent Quirk wrote:
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Ronald Oussoren [mailto:ronaldoussoren at mac.com]
> Sent: Monday, April 10, 2006 4:42 PM
> To: Kent Quirk
> Cc: Dethe Elza; Gábor Farkas; pythonmac-sig at python.org
> Subject: Re: [Pythonmac-SIG] needed: simple gui toolkit with
> "japaneseinput" support
>
> <snip>
>
>>> I get the impression that for those who've used Cocoa and prefer
>>> Python, it's a breath of fresh air...but for those who've not been
>>> swimming in a vat of Cocoa, it's not quite so appetizing.
>
>> And to second Dethe: I'm also a python programmer that likes Cocoa.
>> Heck, I wrote[1] PyObjC because I wanted to use Cocoa from Python.
>
> Which is kinda the point -- you already knew Cocoa and wanted to
> use it in a different context.
Mhhh, I'll have to do more proofreading before I sent out mail. I
didn't know Cocoa when I wrote PyObjC, I wrote PyObjC because Cocoa
seemed to be the best way to write OSX applications at the time
(which was when OSX 10.0 was bleeding edge) and I prefer to program
in Python. I actually learned Objective-C while writing PyObjC.
>
> I don't wish to argue about what's "really" easy or difficult about
> Cocoa. I was trying to point out that people who don't use Cocoa
> already, coming at it from Python, find several things about Cocoa
> to be alien and difficult. And attempting to read and use Cocoa's
> documentation requires that you already "get" Cocoa, and understand
> the logic behind such things as two-stage object creation.
Sadly enough that's also true for someone that tries to learn
Objective-C for wring Ccooa programs. There's not much documentation
that explains the right programming model for Cocoa applications,
which means you'll often be stuck in increasingly complex code until
you stumble across the way the framework designers intended you to
write your code in the first place and most complexity disappears.
>
> I'm really not disparaging Cocoa at all as a development platform.
> I'm merely trying to point out the impedance mismatch between it
> and Python. Sometimes people forget how much they had to learn. For
> people experienced in Cocoa and already familiar with it, the
> similarities are far more important than the differences, and
> PyObjC is a wonderful tool. But for users unfamiliar with Cocoa and
> possibly unfamiliar with the Mac, the learning curve can be
> formidable.
>
There's definitely a learning curve, but I don't think it is too
steep and once you've climbed it you have a very powerfull framework
to write native applications. I'm still amazed at how close the
object models of Python and Objective-C/Cocoa are.
Ronald
More information about the Pythonmac-SIG
mailing list