inactivating bounce processing to speed up list performance
Dear listers, I eventually traced that my mailman installation is delaying the distribution of messages because it is trapped in a bunch of "bounce processing", dealing with undelivered messages, etc... in this regard, could I simply inactivate bounce processing? If I do so I should expect an increase in speed and performance of mailman and a decrease in delays, but I might risk that some members, whose messages could not be delivered for whatever reasons, might loose some of these messages. Is that so? Would you recommend setting Mailman to not performing bounce processing to improve its performance? thanks Lluis
- Lluis Montoliu <montoliu@cnb.csic.es>:
Dear listers, I eventually traced that my mailman installation is delaying the distribution of messages because it is trapped in a bunch of "bounce processing", dealing with undelivered messages, etc... in this regard, could I simply inactivate bounce processing?
No. You need to clean out your lists. Why are you sending out garbage to non-existing addresses at? A properly maintained list has a low percentage of undeliverables - when (as in your case) the undeliverables are exceeding the normal fallout of about 3%, then you're having bad lists.
If I do so I should expect an increase in speed and performance of mailman and a decrease in delays, but I might risk that some members, whose messages could not be delivered for whatever reasons, might loose some of these messages. Is that so?
No.
Would you recommend setting Mailman to not performing bounce processing to improve its performance? thanks Lluis
No.
Sending mail to non-deliverable adresses is going to get you into blacklists. That's how Hotmail and SenderScore work. Furthermore you're going to hit spamtraps sooner or later.
-- Ralf Hildebrandt Geschäftsbereich IT | Abteilung Netzwerk Charité - Universitätsmedizin Berlin Campus Benjamin Franklin Hindenburgdamm 30 | D-12203 Berlin Tel. +49 30 450 570 155 | Fax: +49 30 450 570 962 ralf.hildebrandt@charite.de | http://www.charite.de
Hello all,
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
Any ideas are appreciated.
Thanks.
C.
On 2011-11-23 11:11, Carlos Palomino wrote:
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
Any ideas are appreciated.
Perhaps this comes with users replying to all. So they send their reply to the user and the list.
BTW: This is usually recommended in nettiquetts to do this. I always do it on lists.
Kind regards, Christian Mack
Mailman Admin wrote:
On 2011-11-23 11:11, Carlos Palomino wrote:
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
Any ideas are appreciated.
Perhaps this comes with users replying to all. So they send their reply to the user and the list.
This will cause a duplicate if and only if the "nodups" setting of the recipient who is also directly addressed is off. In a default installation, this setting defaults to On for new subscribers, but the list admin can change it (new_member_options -> Filter out duplicate messages to list members (if possible)), and individual members can change their own settings
Other possibilities include cross posts to multiple lists of which the recipient is a member, and duplication in the delivery chain after the post has left Mailman. The latter may be detectable by comparing the Received: header chain of the two received messages.
Another possibility is duplication caused by filtering/sorting rules in the recipient's MUA. Depending on the exact rules, this could affect only some posts, but would not likely affect more than one user.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
It appears they are replying to all, as in the few header samples I've seen, there are two instances of the group address (in the To and CC fields).
I have the setting checked to filter out duplicates, but still receiving complaints. Not sure how to handle this, as it seems to be on the user's end.
C.
On Nov 23, 2011, at 10:46 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
Mailman Admin wrote:
On 2011-11-23 11:11, Carlos Palomino wrote:
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
Any ideas are appreciated.
Perhaps this comes with users replying to all. So they send their reply to the user and the list.
This will cause a duplicate if and only if the "nodups" setting of the recipient who is also directly addressed is off. In a default installation, this setting defaults to On for new subscribers, but the list admin can change it (new_member_options -> Filter out duplicate messages to list members (if possible)), and individual members can change their own settings
Other possibilities include cross posts to multiple lists of which the recipient is a member, and duplication in the delivery chain after the post has left Mailman. The latter may be detectable by comparing the Received: header chain of the two received messages.
Another possibility is duplication caused by filtering/sorting rules in the recipient's MUA. Depending on the exact rules, this could affect only some posts, but would not likely affect more than one user.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
I seem to have the same problem. It only happens sometimes and to different users.
Robert P. Schwartz 206 Cedar Pond Drive Madison, AL 35757
Phone: 256.830.2933 Cell: 256.509.2981
E-mail: rpschwar@knology.net
-----Original Message----- From: mailman-users-bounces+rpschwar=knology.net@python.org [mailto:mailman-users-bounces+rpschwar=knology.net@python.org] On Behalf Of Carlos Palomino Sent: Wednesday, November 23, 2011 12:09 PM To: Mailman-Users@python.org Subject: Re: [Mailman-Users] Duplicate posts?
It appears they are replying to all, as in the few header samples I've seen, there are two instances of the group address (in the To and CC fields).
I have the setting checked to filter out duplicates, but still receiving complaints. Not sure how to handle this, as it seems to be on the user's end.
C.
On Nov 23, 2011, at 10:46 AM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
Mailman Admin wrote:
On 2011-11-23 11:11, Carlos Palomino wrote:
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They
say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience
this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
Any ideas are appreciated.
Perhaps this comes with users replying to all. So they send their reply to the user and the list.
This will cause a duplicate if and only if the "nodups" setting of the recipient who is also directly addressed is off. In a default installation, this setting defaults to On for new subscribers, but the list admin can change it (new_member_options -> Filter out duplicate messages to list members (if possible)), and individual members can change their own settings
Other possibilities include cross posts to multiple lists of which the recipient is a member, and duplication in the delivery chain after the post has left Mailman. The latter may be detectable by comparing the Received: header chain of the two received messages.
Another possibility is duplication caused by filtering/sorting rules in the recipient's MUA. Depending on the exact rules, this could affect only some posts, but would not likely affect more than one user.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Mailman-Users mailing list Mailman-Users@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-users Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-users%40python.org/ Unsubscribe: http://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-users/rpschwar%40knology.net
Robert P. Schwartz wrote:
I seem to have the same problem. It only happens sometimes and to different users.
Tell the users that when they receive duplicates, they need to send copies of both messages including all headers to you - preferably forwarded as attachments, but any way that preserves all the headers is OK.
Then you have to examine all the headers of both messages to determine where they diverge. The oldest Received: headers (the ones furthest from the top) and headers like Message-ID: and Date: should be the same, but at some point, the newer Received: headers will differ. This is where the duplication occurred.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
Carlos Palomino wrote:
It appears they are replying to all, as in the few header samples I've seen, there are two instances of the group address (in the To and CC fields).
I have the setting checked to filter out duplicates, but still receiving complaints. Not sure how to handle this, as it seems to be on the user's end.
It appears that the issue is you have your list setting reply_goes_to_list set to This list. Thus, posts received from the list are To: the list as sent by the original poster and have a Reply-To: the list added by Mailman. Then a recipient does a reply-all and the recipient's MUA generates a reply To: the list from the Reply-To: with Cc: the list from the original To:. Some MTAs will drop duplicate message recipients, but if none of the MTAs handling this message drop the duplicate, it will be delivered to the list twice, possibly archived twice (the archiver may drop a duplicate Message-ID:), appear twice in digests and be sent twice to message recipients.
You can easily avoid this by setting reply_goes_to_list to Poster. This will solve the problem for the reply-all replies, but those who just reply will find their replies going to the poster rather than the list.
This is really a user education problem, and can't be solved because no matter what you do, some users won't like it.
-- Mark Sapiro <mark@msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan
On 11/23/2011 4:11 AM, Carlos Palomino wrote:
Hello all,
Several subscribers of my list are complaining of duplicate posts. They say it happens "only sometimes".
Are there any common reasons for such occurrences? I don't experience this on my test-member account or in my regularly subscribed address, so it's difficult to track down.
I run about 200 lists, so get this complaint fairly regularly. In virtually every case, or every case it turns out to be user error -- Mailman just doesn't send out duplicate posts, it seems to me. People may have subscribed under two different addresses, or in one case the user had a mail filter in place that was bad, and directed messages to two different places.
Unsubscribe their address, and if they still get messages, have them forward to you with headers, so you can see what is going on at their end.
Dave
participants (7)
-
Carlos Palomino -
David Andrews -
Lluis Montoliu -
Mailman Admin -
Mark Sapiro -
Ralf Hildebrandt -
Robert P. Schwartz