[Chicago] Regarding Text Editors

Tue Nov 1 08:39:30 EDT 2016

I also use a vim plugin that takes advantage of exuberant-ctags.  I
recently changed to tagbar from taglist.

https://majutsushi.github.io/tagbar/

(I found it via https://github.com/fatih/vim-go which is really nice for go
development.)

I also use a professional edition of PyCharm because when I need to use a
debugger it's really nice. And, it's better at autocompletition and
navigating huge messy code bases.

In general for pedagogy, read Mark Guzdial's computing education blog.
https://computinged.wordpress.com which discusses things like editors for
learning, languages for learning, etc. examples:

https://computinged.wordpress.com/2009/10/02/question-everything-how-we-teach-intro-cs-is-wrong/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2014/04/01/how-do-we-make-programming-languages-more-usable-and-learnable/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2016/06/20/how-to-choose-programming-languages-for-learners/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2016/06/13/introducing-gp-a-general-purpose-block-language/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2015/07/08/do-blocks-equal-making-and-text-equal-coding/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2012/02/21/bret-victors-inventing-on-principle-and-the-trade-off-between-usability-and-learning/
https://computinged.wordpress.com/2011/08/23/why-we-ought-to-teach-java-computing-education-and-social-practice/

On Tue, Nov 1, 2016 at 6:16 AM, Aaron Elmquist <elmq0022 at umn.edu> wrote:

> Jason,
>
> A first step to browse a large library with vim is exuberant ctags. This
> creats a file that vim uses to navigate source code.
>
> http://www.held.org.il/blog/2011/02/configuring-ctags-for-python-and-vim/
>
> This helps a fair amount with completion as well.
>
> I hear 'gnu global' is similar to ctags but better for larger code bases.
> I have not used it.
>
> There are vim plugins that support more of the completing features you've
> discussed. They are not easy to setup compared to pycharm.
>
> On Nov 1, 2016 5:52 AM, "Jason Wirth" <wirth.jason at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> For those using vim, how do you jump to definitions of a class, function,
>> etc in a large project?
>>
>> I like vim but I love PyCharm (used with him kebindings). Whenever in
>> don't know how something works, I can jump to the definition in the source.
>> This works even when it's defined somewhere else.
>>
>> Also, are there ways to view classes methods and properties? Eg
>>
>> class Foo(Bar):
>> Pass
>>
>> I should be able to see the methods Foo has (by virtue of sub classing
>> Bar), as well as what methods are overridden. More importantly, I need to
>> see it even when Bar is defined in a other module.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 10:25 PM Anish Krishnan <
>> anish.krishnan.1216 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> (Yes, it was sarcasm.)
>>>
>>> On Oct 31, 2016 10:08 PM, "Michael Tamillow" <mikaeltamillow96 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I hope that's sarcasm...
>>>
>>> Check Wikileaks.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Oct 31, 2016, at 9:32 PM, Anish Krishnan <
>>> anish.krishnan.1216 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I don't think I've read a more offensive email in my life, and I was
>>> involved in politics for 3 years.
>>>
>>> On Oct 31, 2016 8:25 PM, "Michael Tamillow" <mikaeltamillow96 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I'm a strong believer that you should just steal other people's code
>>> from github and stack overflow.
>>>
>>> No need for a development environment, no need for tests, really, no
>>> need for an education system even.
>>>
>>> As long as you use spaces and not tabs I don't care.
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Oct 31, 2016, at 7:25 PM, Quentin Holness <qholness at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> I've come to enjoy Spyder for development purposes though I'm first and
>>> foremost a Sublime guy.
>>>
>>> Spyder has the perks of iPython without the Web server.
>>>
>>> On Oct 31, 2016 7:21 PM, "Bob Haugen" <bob.haugen at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Anybody else use Kate?
>>>
>>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 5:18 PM, Nick Timkovich <prometheus235 at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>> > Text editor X vs IDE Y vs using butterfly species Z to flip SSD bits
>>> with
>>> > cosmic rays, this is all holy war stuff. The big thing is always just
>>> to
>>> > "shut up and code". Roy Underhill and Norm Abrham both can make some
>>> pretty
>>> > sweet stuff.
>>> >
>>> > That said, I would argue you should sample something new every so often
>>> > (i.e. use it as much as possible for a week) and see if it has any
>>> features
>>> > that could win you over. Especially if many of your co-workers also
>>> use it,
>>> > a) maybe they do so for a reason, b) when you're learning that thing
>>> you can
>>> > easily ask them 'what's the easy way to do X'. There is the distinct
>>> > possibility that c) you like your original editor plenty well and
>>> don't see
>>> > a reason to change, but at least you've armed yourself for the next
>>> holy
>>> > battle.
>>> >
>>> > On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 4:43 PM, Japhy Bartlett <japhy at pearachute.com>
>>> > wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> To add a datapoint, I use very vanilla vim, or sublime with vim
>>> >> keybindings.  If you are going to dabble in system administration,
>>> it's
>>> >> incredibly convenient to be comfortable with a terminal based
>>> editor!  It's
>>> >> nice for debugging to have a stripped down environment.
>>> >>
>>> >> I think for learning, IDEs -- or anything that automagically does
>>> stuff
>>> >> for you -- can be problematic because when something breaks, it's
>>> hard for
>>> >> newbies to know what's going on, or how to fix it.  There's an extra
>>> layer
>>> >> of magic that the bug could be in.
>>> >>
>>> >> And from the teachers perspective, does the student really
>>> understand, eg
>>> >> modules and imports?  Or did an IDE hold their hand through it?  Can
>>> they
>>> >> write code *without* an IDE?  Maybe it's moot, but it seems like
>>> learning
>>> >> the basics is important.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> When you transition to a professional environment though, you're
>>> judged by
>>> >> your output, and your choice of editor should be personal
>>> preference.  Once
>>> >> you understand a little about the basics, for sure use the IDE or
>>> whatever
>>> >> helps you move quickly.  It is extremely rude to impose an editor on
>>> your
>>> >> peers!  Try things out and use what sticks.
>>> >>
>>> >> - Japhy
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 4:41 PM, Daniel Fehrenbach
>>> >> <dnfehrenbach at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> >>>
>>> >>> Here at work folks on my team picks individual preferred tools -
>>> Emacs,
>>> >>> Sublime, PyCharm, Atom, Vim etc. I use sublime but I've found it
>>> doesn't
>>> >>> hurt to be able to use all of them to perform the basics of editing
>>> code -
>>> >>> you'll eventually be confronted with a server and only have vim - so
>>> if you
>>> >>> can at least open/edit/save/exit that is really helpful, or if
>>> you're pair
>>> >>> programming with someone it kind of wastes time to struggle with an
>>> editor
>>> >>> you've never used instead of getting work done.
>>> >>>
>>> >>> On Mon, Oct 31, 2016 at 3:32 PM, HADDLETON, Robert W (Bob)
>>> >>> <bob.haddleton at nokia.com> wrote:
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> PyCharm.  If your professors abhor IDEs they aren't preparing their
>>> >>>> students for
>>> >>>> real world jobs.  Familiarity with git and an IDE are pretty much
>>> >>>> expected.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> I use vi/vim/emacs as much as anyone (maybe more) but an integrated
>>> IDE
>>> >>>> used properly
>>> >>>> is essential for medium and large projects with multiple/many
>>> developers
>>> >>>> or which uses a
>>> >>>> large number of external modules.
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> Bob
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>>
>>> >>>> On 10/31/2016 3:00 PM, Aswin kumar wrote:
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Hi,
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Do people in industry use Vim editor or Emacs for software
>>> development
>>> >>>>> in their office or do they use an IDE?  In college my Professors
>>> abhor
>>> >>>>> IDE and suggest us to use VIM or Emacs for development. So I am
>>> >>>>> curious to know if its is the same case in industry.
>>> >>>>>
>>> >>>>> Regards,
>>> >>>>> Aswin.
>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> >>>>
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-- 
shekay at pobox.com
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