[Idle-dev] python ides

vegetax vegetax xv0021 at yahoo.com
Thu Sep 9 21:50:46 CEST 2004

 Hi , i am learning python right now and i am realy
impressed,i like it a lot, but i have faced a big
barrier while learning it, the development

Well, first i come from a strong java background, i
have diggested almost all the ugly the elephants, EJB,
web services, etc  and i must say it was an unpleasant
experience, to make 10 files of
interfaces,decorators,artifacts,bla,bla just to do the
simpliest task,but well.

But i must say that the ides played a huge roll to
make things work in java, generate code, accelerate
coding, completition, etc.I have used all of the most
popular ides for java,
intellj,nerbeans,eclipse,jbuilder,etc and i must say
that eclipse is the most powerfull,but well to the

There are no ides for python! just text editors with
added functionality, i have tried all of them!
My conclusions are that all of them are missing the
point of an ide, to make programers code faster!! most
of the features all them has, i can live without them
but they all miss core features realy needed to code
fast!! I must say that komodo is the best of them,
taking as a parameter, programers productivity, but it
is increadibly slow and ugly in linux(in windows is
very good,what a surprise!)

I like the simplicity of idle, but it needs some core

callback tip suport

 while reading 'python in a nutshell' i needed to see
what functions and attributes the sys module had, on a
java ide i would just type sys. and a list of members
would appear,when i focus on one of them the complete
docstring would appear, that it just a huge save of
time while learning a new module,which happens every
day ,very very often. I wouldnt need to alt-tab the
browser and search for documentation on that
module,neither to go to the shell and type help(sys) ,
and then lookup for the members of the module and
their docs. This is a huge time saver,to see the
properties of an object while coding, and it happens
all the time ,lots of times while coding.

I have made a shell script wich use dir(<object> to
lookup the members, list them in a vertical list(much
more readable) with the first line of docstring at
thei right side of each of them. This is similar to
what the ide should do when i say 'sys.', but i have
to go to the shell, type zdir(<object>) and check out
them, which is still very very slow.

I cant,and i wont remember all the members of all the
objects in python! it is inpractical! especialy for
someone just learning the language, there is just too
much to remember. 

                             code snipets,templates

 This is another real time saver,the hability to type
for example sing + alt + space and that the ide checks
for a sniped i made called singleton and when i press
enter the sniped is copied to the buffer is unvaluable
for fast programing.

advanced code completitions helps a lot too,when i
type SimpleCookie( then the close bracked is completed
for me, same for {, "(for strings), etc , automaticaly
adding imports as a need them,etc. 

refactoring realy improve fast coding and software

I think this is what python needs for a wider
aceptance , python is better than php and java but it
realy realy lacks essensial tools, if idle would come
with those features i am 300% sure that much more
people would give it a shoot,i see the same problem
with lots of people learning python and some
experienced python users who also 'needs' those
essential features.

Would some of those (at least the first one, the most
needed)  features hard to implement? i am wrong in
some of my points?
is idle being active developed? Please i need help, i
dont know what to do =( ,i am losing hope , but i
realy like python.

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