[Mailman-Users] slightly OT: on not becoming a spam source

David Newman dnewman at networktest.com
Fri May 30 17:00:09 CEST 2008

On 5/30/08 4:35 AM, Larry Stone wrote:
> On 5/29/08 11:37 PM, Jim Popovitch at yahoo at jimpop.com wrote:
>> On Fri, May 30, 2008 at 12:18 AM, David Newman <dnewman at networktest.com>
>> wrote:
>>> Hmmm. I must be missing something, as the system is still associating each
>>> Message-ID with all 250 list subscribers.
>> VERP has nothing to do with Message-ID, and everything to do with
>> Return-Path and Sender:   ;-)
> With VERP and personalization, the Return-Path, instead of being
> "listname-bounces at sendingdomain" becomes
> "listname-bounces+recipient=destdomain at sendingdomain".
> I think you said you're using Postfix in which case you need
> "recipient_delimiter = +" in your main.cf so it knows about the plus signs
> in the return paths.

ACK. Yes, that's in main.cf.

> When you then get the AOL TOS e-mail, you can figure out who the list
> recipient was as while AOL redacts the AOL recipient, they don't touch the
> Return-Path.

I wish this were true, but it appears AOL gets to the Return-Path too:

Return-Path: <redacted-bounces+redacted=aol.com at somedomain.com>

So neither Return-ID nor Message-ID identifies who's complaining.

But...this might be something. The next message header contains an ESMTP 
ID that corresponds with exactly one AOL user in maillog:

Received: from rly-mh07.mx.aol.com (rly-mh07.mail.aol.com 
[]) by air-mh02.mail.aol.com (v121.4) with ESMTP id 
MAILINMH024-be4483f8d3acf; Fri, 30 May 2008 01:14:45 -0400
Received: from mail.somedomain.com (mail.somedomain.com 
[666.666.666.666]) by rly-mh07.mx.aol.com (v121.5) with ESMTP id 
MAILRELAYINMH074-be4483f8d3acf; Fri, 30 May 2008 01:14:35 -0400
Received: from localhost (localhost [])
	by mail.somedomain.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B55685B31C0
	for <redacted>; Thu, 29 May 2008 22:14:34 -0000 (UTC)

root at mail:log# grep -i B55685B31C0 /var/log/maillog

May 29 22:14:34 mail postfix/smtpd[25785]: B55685B31C0: 
May 29 22:14:34 mail postfix/cleanup[21262]: B55685B31C0: 
message-id=<C464D8CB.705B%listposter at someotherdomain.net>
May 29 22:14:34 mail postfix/qmgr[23040]: B55685B31C0: 
from=<members-bounces+aoluser=aol.com at somedomain.com>, size=13344, 
nrcpt=1 (queue active)

Given the above, is "aoluser at aol.com" the subscriber that's complaining? 
Or is it just a coincidence that that AOL user got listed first?

many thanks


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