[Python-Dev] Relative Package Imports
Tue, 14 Sep 1999 12:20:53 +0000
Tim Peters wrote:
> > I agree that it's ugly to include the __ attribute in the module
> > namespace due to the possible circular reference (parent->module,
> > module->parent), but the patch I sent doesn't do this... or was
> > "ugly" referring to the two underscores looking strange ?
> > Could you elaborate a bit on the reasons for dropping __ support ?
> There are two sections on why __ was dropped in
> They don't refer to circularity, but to "limited use", "poor readability"
> and "awkwardness".
Which are all quite subjective.
> A deeper reason may be hiding in the essay's "most
> packages will have a relative shallow substructure": this is Guido <wink>,
> the man who invented two-level scoping, and class inheritance without a
> "super" hook back to the (anonymous) parent. For all Python's dynamicism,
> it very much favors shallow, static name hierarchies. I don't think it's
> coincidence that Python's own source code is in a two-level directory
> structure either! The only #include with a ".." is in grammar.h, and there
> it's in a comment <wink>:
> #include "bitset.h" /* Sigh... */
> So if we cut to the core here, I'd bet Guido doesn't object so much to
> relative imports as to the idea that anyone would go off and create a
> package structure so fractally convoluted that relative imports are strongly
> more attractive than naming the target package in full.
> Or maybe Guido doesn't care about that at all. I do regardless. I know
> Python's restrictions can grate, but in all, and in my repeated experience,
> they force you to rethink complicated designs and refactor them into simpler
> schemes that fit what Python is best at spelling. Nesting packages 8 deep
> is clumsy now? Damn straight, and I'm thankful for that: the clumsier it
> is, the less gratuitous inherited complexity I'll have to deal with in my
> future lives <0.5 wink>.
Nobody has suggested building 8-level package hierarchies. In fact,
the example I gave occured when a two-level package hierarchy was
used in a two-level hierarchy.
I don't think the Package structure of Zope is flawed *except*
for the fact that it is one level too *shallow*. The ability to
do relative imports would be very helpful for the work we're doing.
Jim Fulton mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org
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