Event-driven GUIs, PythonWorks, Boa, wxWindows; future directions of event-driven Python?

[Ron Stephens]

Thanks! You give me a lot of good ideas, comments, and food for thought, all of
which are relevant to my upcoming decisions. As you allude to indirectly, and
which I didn't mention in my original post, I would really like to ultimately be
able to use my stuff on the web in web pages readable by standard browsers. But
one step at a time is more than enough ;-)))

I do want to avoid buying Visual Basic or Visual Studio. That's where I draw the
line. I'm really glad that ActiveState is porting Python to .Net, because it's
good for Python and the community, but I do not want to buy into that package.

Maybe you are right, I may just have to dig into Tkinter or wxPython; if so, the
week I'm off on vacation is the right time to do it anyway. But still I must
decide between Tkinter and wxPython, which is a big decision.

I will look into Sun's Forte for java. I will probably want to do a Jython -java
exploration in addition to my main thrust of Python and (Tkinter or wxPython).

If I go with Tkinter, I would always have the option of buying PythonWare's
stuff later, since it is based on Tkinter. I would still like a recommendation
from someone who has used PythonWorks, particularly the gui painter.

If I go with wxWindows, I would have the option of going with Boa Constructor
later. So, my decision between Tkinter and wxPython looms a as large one.

For my web stuff, if I were not into Python, my uses would divide into two
parts. On the one part, some of the stuff I want to do would be eminently
do-able with just HTML and JavaScript. I may well do that  because its just
plain easier in the end. (Maybe DHTML too, but I don't know that yet). But i
really woudl prefer to stick with Python based stuff

The other half of my web stuff will require at least CGI and maybe true server
side scripting. I have opened an account just now with Hoibbiton which allows
CGI but not calls to outside URL's, which I am want to do for some simple but
specific webstuff  to create up to date web links for subjects of interest to
me. Does anyone know of any Python web spider software already written?

I still have not tried Webware or Zope really. Webware sounds more simple and
Zope has the site Hurrah which is $20 per month but exposes Zope and Python
scripts. All of this I learned about on this great list. But obviously I am
going off in too many directions all at once and can not learn all of this in
one short week, even while on vacation and devoting myself completely fulltime
to Python ;-)))

Thanks Dave, for your help!!!

Ron Stephens

res04o20 wrote:

> Hi y'all. I'm new here so bear with me. ;-)
>
> Ron,
> I've had the same "problem". I'm a working SE/ProjectMgr. (26 years), and
> have gotten very spoiled by VB and the like. But, I've also been forced to
> re-learn the old addage, "There is no royal road to Geometry". In other
> words, there ain't no substitute fer just  bitin'-the-bullet and learnin'
> it. Tkinter is the place to start. Do yourself a favor and get a copy of
> "Programming Python 2nd Edition". It's got the best tutorial I've seen yet
> on Tkinter. Everything you learn there will only help you in any other
> paradigm. Tkinter IS event-driven. It's just not "Visual...". I also have
> played with wxPython and like it too.
>
> Now. Here's another way to go. Just use VB or some Office VBE with Forms2
> (or even Word fields or Excel cells) as your gui. The other great book I've
> read, "Programming Python on Win32" shows you how to do it. It's not hard.
> That's of course, if you have access to VB/Office and can stomach using it.
> Some folks just refuse, and I can't blame 'em.
>
> Here's another thing I have been playing with. Download "Forte for Java"
> Community Edition from Sun. It's free. Free is good. It builds Java AWT and
> Swing GUI's. (Could also potentially integrate well with Jython...? ) Design
> a gui, and look at the code it generates. You could just use that code as a
> framework, and convert the code to use Tkinter or wxPython calls instead of
> Java. (Python can do that! See note on Jython below, though.) But you still
> have to KNOW your package and how it works. You'll also get more
> satisfaction and be able to fix your own problems, if your gui builder
> doesn't hide all the details from you.
> BTW, did I mention it's free?
>
> wxPython. I like it, but it's ANOTHER package you have to download, install,
> and learn. It doesn't come with Python. It may in the future. Who knows.
> (One advantage - doesn't depend on Tcl.)
>
> Jython. Love it. Be prepared to learn alot of Java/AWT/Swing. Another
> package. Enough said.
>
> And here's one more idea. DHTML. It's ubiquitous, free and powerful. Makes a
> good gui and there's a ton of free (or cheap) visual designers for it.
> (Check out MacroMedia.com. And Allaire, which they just bought/merged with.
> Look at the HomeSite HTML Editor. Very interesting. And inexpensive. And
> powerful.) Hook in your Python handlers and yer in business. (You might want
> to experiment with using JxScript for the actual event-handlers, and then
> calling your Python routines from there. I've had a little trouble in some
> cases using pure-Python event-handlers. In IE, JxScript is more tightly
> integrated with the DOM.) Course, you'll have to use the .hta model, not
> .htm, to get out of restricted mode and have a full-blown IE app. It's so
> difficult. You have to change one letter in the extension! ;-) See MS
> WebWorkshop site on Reusing Browser Technology and HTA's. (I'm talking
> Win32/IE here. I'm ignorant of Netscape and wary of Mozilla yet. Time will
> tell on that. (ActiveState Komodo is built on Mozilla, and it's an absolute
> dog on performance. Current beta is better than 1.0 but not much. But it's
> getting there...)
> I am seriously considering taking my development team in this direction for
> a new Multi-Dimensional Analysis (OLAP) application for SQL Server.
>
> And lastly, ActiveState has announced "Visual Python". Only problem is, you
> gotta have MS .Net. (shudder) (Yet another implementation of Python. This
> time in C#. Another learning curve to be ultimately successful.)
>
> I've looked at Pythonware and Boa., etc. Good potential. I just don't want
> to be locked into another IDE structure. What if I have to convert out of
> it? What about my project structures? Do they integrate versioning software?
> Do they store everything in XML or DBM or Pickles or Shelves? Or who knows
> what? Just haven't had enough time to look into those issues. Of course,
> these are project management issues which may not be of any concern for your
> purposes. Best thing is just play with them see what works for you and what
> you can afford.
>
> Hope these ideas help. Good luck!
> (And I'll also be interested in other folks' responses!)
>
> Dave Wald
>
> "Ron Stephens" <rdsteph at earthlink.net> wrote in message
> news:3B2B60AD.942719AE at earthlink.net...
> > I am taking a week's vacation the week after next. I plan to spend this
> > week trying to learn event-driven programming using Python. I would sure