[IronPython] Ironpython 0.7 released!

Paolo Molaro lupus at ximian.com
Tue Mar 29 16:42:56 CEST 2005

On 03/28/05 Jim Hugunin wrote:
> I'm in complete agreement that we've got work to do on the IronPython
> community site.  This feedback is great.
> I've had my first experiences using the forums this last week, and I'm
> not particularly excited about them either.  One thing that we're
> investigating is NNTP access to the gotdotnet forums.  If we can get

Well, in that case it would be better to open a proper newsgroup
in the microsoft.public.dotnet.* namespace. Just to reiterate,
the gotdotnet pages for irnopython were down a couple of days ago, too,
so it's not only slow and ugly, but also buggy.
This mailing list is still the best option, IMHO.

> I agree that the bug database could also use some improvement, but it
> would be great if we could figure out how to make the current version
> work for people today.

I think people would rather spend their time testing and improving
ironpython than beta or alpha testing the gotdotnet website:-)

> Some people will see needing a .NET passport as
> a hurdle to filing bug reports and any hurdles we add here are a

It's worse when it's also required to just browse the database.

> mistake.  Nevertheless, have you tried to get a .NET passport?  It's a
> fairly simple process and it should work on any OS.  While this is a
> little cumbersome, I don't think that it's much different from most bug
> trackers that will require a valid email address before accepting bug
> reports.  Do you have a technical reason that you don't want to/can't
> get a passport to file bugs?

Well, after reading the terms of services, I think the only way for
most people to use it is to also break the terms of service which
also means termination of its use. It says:

"To set up an account, you _must_ provide information about yourself and
_update_ this information as necessary in order to keep it current."
And in the privacy statement it says it will collect the timezone info.
Am I supposed to connect and update it while I travel? Of course
the example is absurd, but so is an agreement I have to agree to that is
(a lot) longer than the license to ironpython itself.
It is just an unnecessary hurdle, IMHO: requiring a valid email address
is instead fair and simple.

At the end of the day, I think it all boils down to having IronPython
as a viable project for both the win32 programmers and the free software
community or not. The former are happy with whatever your throw at them
(see the earlier mails about "just give me the binaries" - yes, this is
a simplification). That community is big, so IronPython could live
fine without any contribution from the free software world. But if
that is the case, I'm probably not going to spend my time testing
and supporting IronPython in mono and promoting its use.

[Note for the people that are not used to frank discussions: I never
met Jim personally but I have all the reasons to believe he's a nice
person and I appreciate his contributions. I don't see, though, why
this appreciation should be extended to the gotdotnet website and
the policy decisions that I think are counterproductive to the
IronPython project.]


lupus at debian.org                                     debian/rules
lupus at ximian.com                             Monkeys do it better

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