[Mailman-Users] Email command upgrade

John W. Baxter jwblist at olympus.net
Tue Oct 5 05:34:03 CEST 2004

On 10/4/2004 17:39, "Brad Knowles" <brad at stop.mail-abuse.org> wrote:

> At 5:17 PM -0700 2004-10-04, John W. Baxter wrote:
>>  OK, so what does Eudora do to make the RFC 2919 headers useful?  All I think
>>  it does out of the box is not filter any of them in its presentation of a
>>  message, leading to endless complaints about "those headers" and being the
>>  prime trigger for Mailman's current ability to turn them off.  (Then there
>>  was fine-tuning about the List-Post vs announce-only lists, not caused by
>>  Eudora.)
> Well, by default, it doesn't ignore or hide the List-* headers,
> and turns them into proper clickable links.  If you want to turn that
> behaviour off, then you have to follow the instructions in
> <http://www.python.org/cgi-bin/faqw-mm.py?req=show&file=faq04.001.htp>,
> which apparently a lot of people are stupid enough to do.

Thank you for the URL...clearly making the adjustments has become easier on
the Windows side than it used to be.  (It was always easy on Mac, back long
enough to predate RFC 2919.)

> If so, then the List-* headers are now hidden because you went
> out of your way to configure your MUA to that, and you deserve what
> you get.

Thanks.  What I get is a nice clean window with the one List-* header I need
somewhat often, and the others available at one click of the BLAH Blah blah
button.  (That comment should show that I don't use the Preview pane.)

> This is all that needs to be done to properly implement the RFC.

It's an implementation of the RFC.  As a Eudora user I would much prefer to
see the headers subsumed into a nice menu item or items, or message window
button bar buttons, or some other implementation that doesn't take up so
much of the message space.  And I know from reactions ranging from grumbling
to mutiny in other venues that I'm not alone.

In fact, the message I replied to lumped Microsoft and Qualcomm together; I

However, since I don't use Eudora to handle the bulk of my lists any more,
it's somewhat moot for me.

> Mailman does the right thing here, as does Qualcomm/Eudora.  The real
> problem is Microsoft and all the stupid users who don't want any of
> that crap they can't understand, but which they need.
> Maybe the next edition of Eudora should make it impossible to
> turn off those headers.

I hope not.  That would just trigger more list operators to turn the headers
off in Mailman settings (which would not be a good thing:  the List-*
headers ARE a good thing, when the MUA implements them [rationally]).

When I was using Eudora for lists, I turned off all but List-Post:--others
might elect to leave List-Archive: on as well.


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