Mailman 3 December 2007 - pypy-dev

JVM integration
by Paul deGrandis Jan. 3, 2008

Jan. 3, 2008

Anto, Niko, and All, I have begun working on PyPy again and am starting on jvm integration. After talking briefly with Carl on IRC, I looked at the code in CLI. I have a few questions: It appears as though the general approach is to identify entry points into CLI code (via dlls), use reflection, and make calls. This is also later used to make (r)python modules into dlls themselves (allowing for bidirectional integration). Is this correct? Also, how does the notion of PythonNet play into this (ie: where do you get the CLR module from)? If this is not the current approach, is there a document that someone can point me to that talks about this in further detail? Lastly, as work for integration on the JVM begins, a larger goal is the generalize the approach. Has any work been done in the CLI/CLR to generalize the approach so far? Regards, Paul

2 1

PyPy Leysin Winter Sprint (12-19th January 2008)
by Armin Rigo Dec. 31, 2007

Dec. 31, 2007

===================================================================== PyPy Leysin Winter Sprint (12-19th January 2008) ===================================================================== .. image:: http://www.ermina.ch/002.JPG The next PyPy sprint will be in Leysin, Switzerland, for the fifth time. This is a fully public sprint: newcomers and topics other than those proposed below are welcome. ------------------------------ Goals and topics of the sprint ------------------------------ * Like previous winters, the main side goal is to have fun in winter sports :-) We can take a couple of days off for ski; at this time of year, ski days end before 4pm, which still leaves plenty of time to recover (er, I mean hack). * the overall idea of the sprint is to continue working on making PyPy ready for general use. A few more specific tasks: - app-level ctypes: getting to a basically usable point would be really nice. - JIT: there is a long-standing timeshifter refactoring, towards making the JIT be more interpreter-like. Starting it during the sprint might be a good way to share some of the knowledge of how the JIT really works. Alternatively, we can work on supporting ootype in the timeshifter. - Testing: e.g. we run various nightly test runs but the results are not summarized in a single page yet. - LLVM: llvm 2 is now at version 2.1 and nicely stable again. Our llvm backend has improved in the last few months, but refactoring it together with the genc backend to share code more directly would be a nice task. * We are open to all sorts of other tasks during the sprint, just propose something. ----------------------- Location & Accomodation ----------------------- Leysin, Switzerland, "same place as before". Let me refresh your memory: both the sprint venue and the lodging will be in a very spacious pair of chalets built specifically for bed & breakfast: http://www.ermina.ch/. The place has a good ADSL Internet connexion with wireless installed. You can of course arrange your own lodging anywhere (so long as you are in Leysin, you cannot be more than a 15 minute walk away from the sprint venue), but I definitely recommend lodging there too -- you won't find a better view anywhere else (though you probably won't get much worse ones easily, either :-) I made pre-reservations in the Chalet, so please *confirm* quickly that you are coming so that we can adjust the reservations as appropriate. The rate so far has been around 60 CHF a night all included in 2-person rooms, with breakfast. There are larger rooms too (less expensive) and maybe the possibility to get a single room if you really want to. Please register by svn: http://codespeak.net/svn/pypy/extradoc/sprintinfo/leysin-winter-2008/people… or on the pypy-sprint mailing list if you do not yet have check-in rights: http://codespeak.net/mailman/listinfo/pypy-sprint You need a Swiss-to-(insert country here) power adapter. There will be some Swiss-to-EU adapters around - bring a EU-format power strip if you have one. ----------- Exact times ----------- Officially, 12th-19th January 2008. Both dates are flexible, you can arrive or leave earlier or later. We will give introductions and tutorials depending on who needs them, either on the 13th or the 14th. -+- Carl Friedrich, Armin

1 0

Preliminary ctypes-based pysqlite implementation
by Gerhard Häring Dec. 25, 2007

Dec. 25, 2007

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Dear pypy developers, A few weeks ago, I've read with great interest the thread "missing things for making PyPy "production" ready (for some value of production)" on this list. That's when I decided to help with the standard library and the module I'm most familiar with, the "sqlite3" module based on pysqlite. Mercurial mirror here: http://hg.ghaering.de/pysqlite3/ Download with "hg clone http://hg.ghaering.de/pysqlite3/" if Mercurial installed. This is in a rough pre-alpha state now so that one set of pysqlite's unit tests pass (the DB-API ones). It's really rough code I'd not normally release to the public, but xorAxAx (Alexander Schremmer) on #pypy said it would perhaps motivate people to improve PyPy's ctypes implementation. I didn't get PyPy to compile correctly (*), but trying to import the "pysqlite3 pre-alpha" led an error about c_void_p() not working. This demonstrates: $ pypy/bin/py.py --withmod-_ffi >>>> from ctypes import * >>>> ptr = c_void_p() Traceback (application-level): File "<inline>", line 1 in <interactive> ptr = c_void_p() TypeError: __init__() takes exactly 2 arguments (1 given) >>>> ptr = c_void_p() This is probably just one of the issues that hinder using the new pysqlite with PyPy. It would be extra sweet if one of you could hack on ctypes to make it more compatible with the CPython one, but patches to my code to make it work with PyPy's ctypes would also be welcome. I'll give experimenting with PyPy/ctypes another shot myself when the svn version starts to compile (err. translate?!) again. The version on top of CPython is too slow for such experiments. Cheers, - -- Gerhard (*) "python translate.py --run targetpypystandalone.py --withmod-_ffi" crashes with current pypy svn -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFHcTqsdIO4ozGCH14RArbyAKCNF5AGhSBs/taqxE+WZDl6xlmjDgCeMK4b Gn6F7n3Rhn170xnXybnNFEk= =AvIW -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

2 1

Sprint in Leysin?
by Armin Rigo Dec. 23, 2007

Dec. 23, 2007

Hi all! Around the Gothenburg sprint, we mentioned the idea to hold a sprint in Leysin (Switzerland) again this winter. We don't have the EU any more to pay us, but the Swiss Franc is now cheaper compared to the Euro :-) I checked with the "usual place", Chalet Ermina, and with my own schedule. The best dates would be in January before the 26th; afterwards it becomes a bit harder. If mid-January is too soon or otherwise too impossible for too many people I can check again for later in the winter, say in March (ski conditions are usually still good). What do you think about it? A bientot, Armin.

7 6

Roadmap draft
by Carl Friedrich Bolz Dec. 20, 2007

Dec. 20, 2007

Hi all! Just to inform you a bit: Several PyPy developers have sat together and worked on a very rough roadmap for what tasks need to be done to make PyPy a realistic replacement for CPython. The work is going on here: https://codespeak.net/svn/pypy/extradoc/planning/roadmap/ We plan to work on this some more in the next days. As soon as it is in a more finished state we will ask write a mail to pypy-dev again and ask for general feedback. Cheers, Carl Friedrich

7 13

Microbenchmark plots
by Armin Rigo Dec. 19, 2007

Dec. 19, 2007

Hi all, Michael has been running microbenchmarks on the tuatara machine (a PowerPC OS/X) for quite a while now. In case you don't know them, they are at http://tuatara.cs.uni-duesseldorf.de/benchmark.html. Now I've plugged this information through a CGI script using gnuplot, and it gives this: http://wyvern.cs.uni-duesseldorf.de/~arigo/plots.html (lower is better). In the last couple of days it was a useful tool to find out a few mistakes we made over the months - notaby, several innocent-looking checkins that disabled some useful optimization as a side-effect. As you can see on the right edge of the graphs, as of today - with these mistakes corrected - we are faster than ever on Richards and Pystone, and our custom GCs beat Boehm hand-down, too. A bientot, Armin

1 0

In case you don't read comp.lang.python.announce
by Laura Creighton Dec. 14, 2007

Dec. 14, 2007

Looks like we are being asked for by name. Laura ------- Forwarded Message From: Raymond Hettinger <python(a)rcn.com> Newsgroups: comp.lang.python.announce Subject: Call for Papers (Python or PyPy): Workshop on Self-sustaining Systems (S3) 2008 Date: Thu, 13 Dec 2007 11:41:44 -0800 (PST) Organization: http://groups.google.com Lines: 95 *** Workshop on Self-sustaining Systems (S3) 2008 *** May 15-16, 2008 Potsdam, Germany http://www.swa.hpi.uni-potsdam.de/s3/ - -- Call for papers: The Workshop on Self-sustaining Systems (S3) is a forum for discussion of topics relating to computer systems and languages that are able to bootstrap, implement, modify, and maintain themselves. One property of these systems is that their implementation is based on small but powerful abstractions; examples include (amongst others) Squeak/ Smalltalk, COLA, Klein/Self, PyPy/Python, Rubinius/Ruby, and Lisp. Such systems are the engines of their own replacement, giving researchers and developers great power to experiment with, and explore future directions from within, their own small language kernels. S3 will be take place May 15-16, 2008 at the Hasso-Plattner-Institute in Potsdam, Germany. It is an exciting opportunity for researchers and practitioners interested in self-sustaining systems to meet and share their knowledge, experience, and ideas for future research and development. - -- Invited talk: Ian Piumarta: Late-bound Object Lambda Architectures (Viewpoints Research Institute, USA) - -- Submissions and proceedings: S3 invites submissions of high-quality papers reporting original research, or describing innovative contributions to, or experience with, self-sustaining systems, their implementation, and their application. Papers that depart significantly from established ideas and practices are particularly welcome. Submissions must not have been published previously and must not be under review for any another refereed event or publication. The program committee will evaluate each contributed paper based on its relevance, significance, clarity, and originality. Revised papers will be published as post-proceedings in the Springer LNCS series. Papers should be submitted electronically via EasyChair at http://www.easychair.org/conferences/?conf=s3 in PDF format. Submissions must be written in English (the official language of the workshop) and must not exceed 20 pages. They should use the LNCS format, templates for which are available at http://www.springer.de/comp/lncs/authors.html. - -- Venue: Hasso-Plattner-Institut (Potsdam, Germany) - -- Important dates: Submission of papers: February 15, 2008 Author notification: April 11, 2008 Revised papers due: April 25, 2008 S3 workshop: May 15-16, 2008 Final papers for LNCS post-proceedings due: June 6, 2008 - -- Chairs: * Robert Hirschfeld (Hasso-Plattner-Institut Potsdam, Germany) * Kim Rose (Viewpoints Research Institute, USA) - -- Program committee: * Johan Brichau, Universite Catholique de Louvain, Belgium * Pascal Costanza, Vrije Universiteit Brussel, Belgium * Wolfgang De Meuter, Vrije Universiteit Brussel, Belgium * Stephane Ducasse, INRIA Lille, France * Michael Haupt, Hasso-Plattner-Institut, Germany * Robert Hirschfeld, Hasso-Plattner-Institut, Germany * Dan Ingalls, Sun Microsystems Laboratories, USA * Martin von Löwis, Hasso-Plattner-Institut, Germany * Hidehiko Masuhara, University of Tokyo, Japan * Ian Piumarta, Viewpoints Research Institute, USA * David Ungar, IBM, USA - -- Registration fees: Early (until April 18, 2008) * Regular participants: EUR 160 * Students: EUR 80 Late (after April 18, 2008) * Regular participants: EUR 170 * Students: EUR 90 - -- http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/python-announce-list Support the Python Software Foundation: http://www.python.org/psf/donations.html ------- End of Forwarded Message

1 0

adding support for Generic classes in the "/module/clr"
by amit Dec. 12, 2007

Dec. 12, 2007

Support for generic classes ---IronPythonic way--------- from System.Collections.Generic import * l = List[str]() l.Add("Hello") l.Add("Hi") l.Add(3) # fails with ValueError: d = Dictionary[str, int]() d.Add('abc', 1) d.Add('def', 2) for i in d.Keys: print d[i] So here in pypy-clr what we'd like to do is import System.Collections.Generic.LinkedList<str> l= System.Collections.Generic.LinkedList<str>() l.Add("hello") l.Add("hi") l.Add(3) # throw ValueError exception the import is to be analysed if its an import for a Generic Class and loaded as clr.load_cli_generic_class('System.Collections.Generic','LinkedList<str>') The implementation of load_cli_generic_class is a BlackBox to me as of now. From the import line we can check if the class is a "generic" and then reflection can be used to determine: a) Generic type b) type arguments c) Parameter attributes .... and more I hope somehow the existing build_wrapper could be used after putting some checks but I am not sure how. -AmitReg

2 1

PyPy talk not accepted at PyCon
by Laura Creighton Dec. 11, 2007

Dec. 11, 2007

------- Forwarded Message Return-Path: pycon-pc(a)python.org Delivery-Date: Tue Dec 11 09:01:50 2007 Return-Path: <pycon-pc(a)python.org> Subject: PyCon 2008 proposal #81 decision From: pycon-pc(a)python.org To: fijall(a)gmail.com, lac(a)openend.se Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2007 07:34:57 GMT Message-Id: <20071211073457.5EE8E2D02A(a)rampart.timecastle.net> Dear Maciej Fijalkowski, Ms. Laura A Creighton, we are sorry to inform you that your proposal, "The PyPy way and the tales of nice features and pleasant design", was not accepted for inclusion in the conference program. PyCon has grown tremendously over the last few years; this year we received over 140 proposals, and had space in the schedule for less than half. A number of excellent proposals had to be cut. We do want you to know that PyCon will feature a number of Open Space sessions that are not part of the formal presentation schedule. Please consider presenting your talk as an Open Space presentation, or as a five-minute lightning talk. Thank you for your effort in submitting a proposal, and we hope you will still join us in Chicago! We are attaching the program committee's reviews of your proposal below; they are also visible to authors on the PyCon website. Finally, we want to hear your thoughts on this year's online proposal system and submission process. What went well? What could've been better? Please take a moment to provide feedback: < http://us.pycon.org/2008/survey/propmgr/ > Alternatively, you may provide comments in reply to this e-mail. Sincerely, Ivan KrstiÄ <ivan(a)laptop.org>, program committee chair, PyCon 2008 David Goodger <goodger(a)python.org>, conference chair, PyCon 2008 - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Proposal: < http://us.pycon.org/2008/conference/proposals/81/ > Reviewer #73: +1 PyPy talks at PyCon have not been represented well so far. This talk has the potential to clarify a lot of the mystery which many people still associate with the PyPy project. ................................................................................ Reviewer #4: +0 PyPy is interesting. My concern (and thus +0) is that it is too big for a 30 min talk. The 30 min limit needs to be taken into consideration when planning the timed outline. ................................................................................ Reviewer #76: +0 I think this could be a good talk. It's an interesting project, but it seems like it would have a somewhat limited audience. The author mentions demos, which will be important to make things concrete. - -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- You have received this e-mail because you are participating in PyCon 2008. If you feel you have received this e-mail in error, please contact: Jeff Rush at jeff(a)taupro.com ------- End of Forwarded Message

3 2

Re: [pypy-dev] PyPy talk not accepted at PyCon
by Laura Creighton Dec. 11, 2007

Dec. 11, 2007

In a message of Tue, 11 Dec 2007 11:58:39 +0100, Maciek Fijalkowski writes: >Laura Creighton wrote: > > > <snip> > >This is slightly misleading. There *is* pypy talk (Christians about >stackless) accepted, just not this one. > >Cheers, >fijal Ah yes, sorry about that. Laura

1 0