Mailman 3 August 2001 - Twisted

[Twisted-Python] Twisted Python 0.7.0 Prerelease Testing
by Glyph Lefkowitz 05 Aug '21

05 Aug '21

hi there, folks: I'd really like to release 0.7.0 but I would like it to be at least a little bit tested before I do so. Could those of you with CVS trees check everything out and see if it performs as advertised? Deeper bugs than that will have to wait for the next release, but I'd at least like to know if it works for someone other than me. Thanks. ______ __ __ _____ _ _ | ____ | \_/ |_____] |_____| |_____| |_____ | | | | @ t w i s t e d m a t r i x . c o m http://www.twistedmatrix.com/~glyph/

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[Twisted-Python] What you thought would always last has passed you by...
by Glyph Lefkowitz 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

Apologies for the dearth of information on the mailing list and releases lately. I've been working on a new job, visiting my family, and some other things. However, I have been pouring quite a bit of effort into Twisted Python as well. The most exciting new development is Perspective Broker, the erstwhile replacement for Gloop; I'm currently starting to remove the old gloop-protocols in .web and .reality and replace them with the newer, more robust perspective protocol. Perspective Broker is more than just a more robust Gloop, though; it's a culmination of all my thinking about XML-RPC, CORBA, PyRO, and RMI. The first application that uses it to its full potential won't be available for a while, but trust me, it'll be cool :-) Chris Armstrong has been doing a first-class job taking care of some structural refactorings that needed to be done to make twisted.web and twisted.reality worthwhile; although this doesn't meet our stated release goals for 0.9.0, I really think that this release is worthy of a major version bump. Finally, in a roundabout way, the issue was raised that perhaps we should change the project's name. Twisted Python is mimsleading; it's not a distribution of python, it's a collection of things written *in* python (the convention is that other projects -- Stackless Python, Active Python, Mac Python, Jython -- are actually interpreters). Rather than attempmting to elevate the status of the somewhat dubious 'ouroboros' module, it might be better just to call the full distribution TwistedMatrix-0.9.0 on the next release, with individual modules eventually being released separately (TwistedWeb/TwistedReality/TwistedPB). Any thoughts on the name change issue? ______ __ __ _____ _ _ | ____ | \_/ |_____] |_____| |_____| |_____ | | | | @ t w i s t e d m a t r i x . c o m http://twistedmatrix.com/users/glyph

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[Twisted-Python] Another tcp.Client question
by Itamar 02 Sep '01

02 Sep '01

Another question - shouldn't we return when getting a EWOULDBLOK or friends, since we haven't yet connected? ======================== class Client(Connection): #... def doConnect(self): """I connect the socket. Then, call the protocol's makeConnection, and start waiting for data. """ try: self.socket.connect(self.addr) except socket.error, se: if se.args[0] in (EWOULDBLOCK, EALREADY, EINPROGRESS): pass ########### XXX shouldn't this be "return"? XXX else: self.protocol.connectionFailed() return CONNECTION_LOST # If I have reached this point without raising or returning, # that means that the socket is connected.

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[Twisted-Python] What the hell?
by Itamar 02 Sep '01

02 Sep '01

From tcp.py: ============ class Client(Connection): """A client for TCP (and similiar) sockets. """ def __init__(self, host, port, protocol): """Initialize the client, setting up its socket, and request to connect. """ if host == 'unix': # "port" in this case is really a filename ... ============ That is sooo wrong. What if my computer is named 'unix'? Why does the TCP code deal with files?

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[Twisted-Python] reality server vs PUB
by Chris.Hadgis＠mincom.com 01 Sep '01

01 Sep '01

Is it my imagination, or is twisted.reality somewhat similar to Python Universe Builder? I have just discovered this after reading through the i-f newsgroups this morning. I plan on downloading it and taking it home to look at. Does anyone else know anything about this? Btw, how do I go about getting a TM home-page? Cheers, ChrisH -- This transmission is for the intended addressee only and is confidential information. If you have received this transmission in error, please delete it and notify the sender. The contents of this e-mail are the opinion of the writer only and are not endorsed by the Mincom Group of companies unless expressly stated otherwise.

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[Twisted-Python] I am not my freaking khakis.
by Chris Armstrong 31 Aug '01

31 Aug '01

Hey everybody. I just wanted to drop a note that I haven't died, but rather school has started, and with work and a girlfriend on top of that, I've had very little time to come around on IRC, let alone hack Twisted or any related projects. I really can't see myself continuing with TWN, so I hope some kind soul might pick that up. I can help out, but the problem is committing to a consistent schedule for TWN. I really can't help but feel like I'm letting you guys down, but I'm going to do my best to actually get around to doing some work here and there. Anyways, it's really exciting to see what everyone's been doing, Twisted just keeps blowing me away, both with it's functionality and it's popularity. Keep up the good work, guys. I'm proud of you. :> -- Chris Armstrong carmstro(a)twistedmatrix.com http://twistedmatrix.com/~carmstro carmstro(a)dynup.net

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[Twisted-Python] Current Working Directory - Just say no
by Moshe Zadka 29 Aug '01

29 Aug '01

Glyph, please, please remove the currentDirectory from the plugins list. This is a security hole waiting to happen. This is your brain. This is your brain in the current working directory. -- The Official Moshe Zadka FAQ: http://moshez.geek The Official Moshe Zadka FAQ For Dummies: http://moshez.org Read the FAQ

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Re: [Twisted-Python] Reality Servers
by Chris.Hadgis＠mincom.com 29 Aug '01

29 Aug '01

I downloaded the TRDemo zip file yesterday and everything works okay now... I have identified three problems I will look at as time permits (1) 'pull string' of the John Romero action figure results in the broadcast messages appearing twice. Calls to broadcastToPair() appear but calls to broadcast() do not. I don't know why. I changed the function so the John Romero messages actually appear now. I don't know why broadcast() won't work from the 'pull string' function. (2) obvious exits should always show the obvious exits from the player's room even when you are looking at an object. Glyph mentioned this yesterday. (3) add an 'examine' verb, which is the same as 'look at'. I want to use 'x' as a short-cut for examine, but the code for direction short-cuts won't work in this case - direction short-cuts replace the whole sentence with the full command. If ANYONE has problems with tkfaucet, please add them to the list and I will see what I can do about fixing them. Cheers, ChrisH -- This transmission is for the intended addressee only and is confidential information. If you have received this transmission in error, please delete it and notify the sender. The contents of this e-mail are the opinion of the writer only and are not endorsed by the Mincom Group of companies unless expressly stated otherwise.

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[Twisted-Python] UML Whiteboard Concept
by Jason L. Asbahr 29 Aug '01

29 Aug '01

(You may see this email twice. It's been 24 hours since I mailed the original message, but it hasn't made it to the list yet...) Twisted people, I wanted to share some thoughts on a UML Whiteboard concept I've been kicking around. BUT FIRST, some ravings: I just got back from SIGGRAPH, which was mind blowing. Some amazing art projects and emerging technology projects both simple and complex. There was also the expo area, which was more of the usual trade show style, but all neat. :-) One cool type of product on display in the expo was the 3D object printer. There were two companies, one using a silica powder and "sugar water" solution to create 3D objects, the other using what appeared to be liquefied plastic of some sort. Given a detailed mesh, these machines can create objects which have internal moving parts (no gears shown yet, but they did have spheres within spheres and an item which had one ring inside another with ball bearings between them, done in a single printing process...) And the silica powder models will absorb liquid, which they use to change the physical properties of the resulting object. By soaking the object in a glue-like liquid, it becomes very rigid and strong (one piece supporting the weight of the salesman demonstrating it), and by soaking it in a rubber-like liquid it becomes somewhat flexible and squishy (kinda like Nerf material). Cool stuff! Anyway.... I'm thinking of designing a new UML diagramming tool because I'm really unsatisfied with the existing ones. This future tool would be client-server, a collaborative UML diagramming whiteboard, with versioning. I'm thinking of an "extreme programming" version of a UML diagramming tool, if you can imagine that, something very lightweight but damn useful for design collaboration and brainstorming sessions. Interoperability with Rational Rose or TogetherJ (using XMI, the XML standard for UML) would be an important later goal. Components that would be used to assemble the tool: - Server and remote object protocol: Twisted, http://www.twistedmatrix.com (natch :-) - Client: wxPython, http://www.wxpython.org, and wxOGL, the wxWindows version of the Object Graphics Library canvas library Of course, multiple client implementations could exist using other toolkits. I'm imagining that the whiteboard would support multiple documents open at the same time, allowing users to cut and paste and to compare documents. (Not being able to have multiple documents open on my desktop was something that frustrated me when I was using Rational Rose...) I want to avoid an explicit hand-off of editing control, turn taking seems like an additional burden on remote collaboration -- one that should emerge from the interaction of the participants rather than being forced on them by the tool. Instead, I imagine that users will be granted an implicit lock on objects they select for editing (a text field, a class, a method-invocation line). Perhaps the tool should have two selection modes -- select-for- highlighting and select-for-editing. The first mode would be for drawing attention to an element, say left click to highlight and the graphic gets emphasized on everyone's display. The second mode would be the implicit lock mode, achieved by double clicking or right-clicking. Additionally, many of the systems which the UML tool would use would also be useful for other applications. Multiuser object manipulation, the locking mechanism, object versioning, partial object transmission, and so on. In the foggy, distant future I'd love to have a design tool that actually worked seamlessly with my code development. New classes and methods typed into an editor would be added to the design model as I typed them, and new methods and classes created in code as I drew them in the tool. Source files per se would be the exported data of the tool, internally code would be represented in a structured format at various levels of granularity (package, class, method). Smalltalky. Resonant with the manhole concept, definitely. Here is my current list of references for this project, FYI: [ References ] UML Specs http://www.celigent.com/omg/umlrtf/artifacts.htm A kick-ass collection of resources on object oriented programming: http://www.eecs.lehigh.edu/~glennb/oose/oose.htm FreeCase project http://www.freecase.seul.org/ Client / server, documents of concepts to borrow UML Pad http://web.tiscali.it/ggbhome/umlpad/umlpad.htm (maybe dead) Dia http://www.lysator.liu.se/~alla/dia/ Viseo-like drawing tool OpenThorn http://members.nbci.com/openthorn/ wxWindows Rose Clone (closed source?) CLIP-based UML Patterns extractor: http://www.geocities.com/ResearchTriangle/Node/2005/ UML Tool Survey Report Summary: http://www.unicorn.cz/lat/distribution/_downloads/es-srovnani_case_nastroju- yphise.pdf --- And here's a quick brainstorm of a list of use cases: [ Use Cases ] Application Management: - User launches diagramming client - Client connects to Twisted server - Client connects to Twisted service Document Management: - User creates new diagram - User creates new state diagram - User creates new sequence diagram - ... - User saves diagram - Diagram automatically saved on edit? - Diagram automatically versioned? - User opens diagram Document Editing: - User drags new glyph instance onto diagram - User selects an existing glyph instance - NOTE: this implicitly locks the object - User moves glyph instance - User deletes glyph instance - User drags connection between two glyph instances Utility: - Client requests index of documents - Client requests document - Server transmits index of documents to client - Server transmits document to client Thoughts? Jason

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Re: [Twisted-Python] Reality Servers
by Chris.Hadgis＠mincom.com 27 Aug '01

27 Aug '01

Glyph Lefkowitz <glyph(a)twistedmatrix.com> Sent by: twisted-python-admin(a)twistedmatrix.com 27/08/2001 04:05 PM Please respond to twisted-python To: twisted-python(a)twistedmatrix.com cc: Fax to: Subject: Re: [Twisted-Python] Reality Servers > On Mon, Aug 27, 2001 at 10:45:57AM +1000, Glenn.Rieger(a)mincom.com wrote: > > The bad news is the username/password for TRDemo no longer seems to be > > guest/guest > Hmm. It seems to work here. What configuration are you running on? I am running on Win98. The date on the zip file is August 21st. I don't have any problems running the Inheritance demo. > > The good news is this does not kill faucet, but results in a cute "oops, > > unauthorized" message. Hmm, I may look at getting that to appear as a > > pop-up tk message-box. > Cool :) I am glad to say it works. You get the printed message as well as a tkMessageBox. I will send you (Glyph) a zip file containing the code I refer to in this e-mail. > > Am I using the wrong username and password for TRDemo or is something > > missing somewhere else? The Inheritance demo runs okay. > As I said, it works fine here. Are you using the latest TRDemo.tar.gz from the > website? There were a few changes... (I suppose we should be doing versioned > releases of both games, too, though so few things are changing it didn't seem > worth it) Maybe they should be versions of the games. When I get around to writing one, after playing with faucet for a while, it will be kept under version control. How old are these games? When were they written? > > Is anyone currently working on the gtkfaucet? If not, then I would like to > > know if I can make changes to the core reality product. I will try where > > possible not to break the gtkfaucet functionality, but since I can't test > > it I won't make promises :) If there is someone using gtkfaucet, I would > > appreciate hearing from you to work out some arrangement when I feel I > > need to change or add to the existing reality scripts. > Explain "core reality product"? What functionality, specifically, do you want > to change? Sorry, that's Mincom-speak coming out :) I meant the scripts in twisted\reality. If I change tkfaucet, gtkfaucet will still run quite happily. If I happen to change "thing.py", then that will affect gtkfaucet too. I am not looking at changing anything specific right now, but as I get more comfortable with the code, there may be changes I wish to make. For example, I may implement an "examine" command, which is the same as "look at", but is only one word and can be short-cut to "x" (see TADS). > The gtkfaucet is part of our acceptance tests. If you're going to check > something in to CVS that breaks those tests, you need to find a way to test or > find someone else who will test for you. If you're not going to do anything > with CVS, feel free to send a patch! I'll test it before I integrate it :) I would love to be able to test gtkfaucet myself, but I do not have "gtk.py". Is it available for Windows? If so, I would like to get a copy. It would make it easier to compare tkfaucet and gtkfaucet and it would make sure I didn't break anything. I don't know if I would be able to access CVS from where I am, at least for now. If it is okay, I'd like to send patches to you. What form would you like the patch in? > > I have created DOS bat files as wrappers for building a reality tap and > > for running the tap with twistd. It contains the required commands plus a > > few house-keeping details like removing log and pid files before running. > Cool, I'd like to see those. See zip file I will send you soon after posting this message. > > Currently, I have (1) modified the tkfaucet to word-wrap the description > > and item frames, (2) display them at a reasonable width and height, (3) > Hmm. Does 'reasonable width and height' work cross-platform? Yes, I just meant I changed the number of characters displayed in the frames. The description frame is 72w x 12h, the item frame is 36w x 12h, and the happenings frame is 6h. This fits okay on a 800x600 screen, and even on a 640x480 :) > > added the shortcut code from gtkfaucet. I'm not entirely happy about the > > shortcuts, as I believe the "go north" command should have "n" as a > > synonym. However, I will leave it as is until I get around to looking at > > these commands. > The shortcut code I'm *VERY* happy to hear about, I've been hoping that someone > would fix that for a while! 'n' is a synonym for 'go north' in gtkfaucet, so > I'm not sure what you're talking about... See zip file I will send you soon after posting this message. In the system I am familiar with a travel verb is defined - nVerb - whose verbs (synonyms) are 'n', 'north', and 'go north'. The travel verb has an associated action which moves the player north. This is the distinction I make between a synonym and a shortcut. I admit the shortcut code is small, neat, and efficient, so I almost certainly won't change it. If there are other changes you wish to see made in tkfaucet, let me know and I will add them to my list. > > I don't like the idea that when you "look at" something, like the Colt > > pistol for example, your location changes to Colt pistol. That is, you > > have to perform a "look" command before you can move to another location. > Your location does not change. > It changes your _focus_, the object you're looking at. The "obvious exits" > thing is sort of broken, and I apologise for that. However, you do not need to > issue another 'look' command before you can move. I tried that last night and it works as you said. I think the next thing I will look at is the 'Obvious Exits' code. I like this feature. In a TADS game, I would implement a verb called "exits" which would display the exits the player knows about. > > This is all I have to report at the moment. I would have had more but I > > got side-tracked playing the IF game Moist (written in TADS). Now *that* > > would have some interesting possibilities in a multi-player environment :) > Wonderful! It's good to hear a report of any progress at all, so don't feel > bad! Also, don't consider playing IF a waste of time. It's "market research". > :-) See zip file I will send you soon after posting this message. Cheers, ChrisH -- This transmission is for the intended addressee only and is confidential information. If you have received this transmission in error, please delete it and notify the sender. The contents of this e-mail are the opinion of the writer only and are not endorsed by the Mincom Group of companies unless expressly stated otherwise.

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