Mailman 3 May 2003 - Mailman-Developers

Multiple bounces in 1 reply
by Colin Mackinlay 03 May '03

03 May '03

I have started to receive bounce messages grouped together and mailman can't recognise them. Is this an unusual bounce format not worth the effort or is it worth adding to the "to do" list? The bounce contents are: This is the mail delivery agent at messagelabs.com. I was not able to deliver your message to the following addresses. <xxx(a)hotmail.com>: 65.54.253.99 does not like recipient. Remote host said: 550 Requested action not taken: mailbox unavailable <xxx(a)btinternet.com>: 194.73.73.118 does not like recipient. Remote host said: 550 Unknown local part xxx in <xxx(a)btinternet.com> <xxx(a)mail.com>: 205.158.62.33 does not like recipient. Remote host said: 550 <xxx(a)mail.com>: inactive user This is the mail delivery agent at messagelabs.com. --- Below this line is a copy of the message. -- Colin Mackinlay

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Moderated-edit
by mch＠cix.compulink.co.uk 03 May '03

03 May '03

Barry Warsaw <barry(a)python.org> wrote, inter alia: > > 2) Moderated-edit. I'm running Mailman on a couple of boxes but I > > There is kludgey support for this now, that most people are probably not > aware of: in the admindb interface, you forward the message to yourself. > Then you use whatever tools you want to edit the message and resend it > back to the list with the Approved header. Then you delete the message > from the admindb. Not exactly the most efficient workflow. ;) Ah, that's it. And what is the Approved header like? Can't find it in the www.lists.org documentation. Currently waiting to see whether List-Approved: <a moderator address> works. Well, it wasn't a *bad* guess... but it was wrong, in that the message still came up requiring moderation. > The thing that's always held me back here is designing a useable u/i to > such a feature. Actually doing the editing probably isn't difficult, > but I'm far from a web u/i expert. Doing it in a way that won't get > clobbered by huge messages, be vulnerable to cross-site scripting or > other security issues, and that provides a natural editing interface, is > a big task. I wish there was some free tool we could just bolt on to do > this -- I'm wondering if something like SquirrelMail could be > appropriated for the task? Wouldn't it be enough to offer editing in the standard TEXTAREA, having first checked that the message isn't stupidly large? Then users who sent stupidly large messages that needed editing, or non-plain-text attachments that needed editing, would simply get them bounced. And then they might get to grasp the virtues of plain text and brevity. Which would be a Good Thing. (List I moderate have a max message size of 10k and no attachments. More than that is too much to be skimming.) I've briefly tried and failed to think of an exploit that works in a TEXTAREA. Someone will be along in a moment to correct me. Mike

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Priority/status of moderated-edit and external user DB
by Kevin McCann 03 May '03

03 May '03

Hello, I'm curious about the status and priority of two features which, as far as I know, have yet to be implemented in Mailman. 1) External user database. I'm sure you're all aware of the desire of some folks to have this. I found a Wiki document somewhere on the zope.org site that had discussions on this but I believe it was somewhat dated. Have any conclusions been reached with respect to the direction here? I think I read talk of a Zope-specific solution. I'm wondering if this means that we're likely never to see a Mailman that can talk to a MySQL database. I believe this one feature alone would elevate Mailman significantly. How hgh of a priority is this to the development team and what is the status? Are there current discussions on this somewhere other than the list (wiki boards, chats, what-have-you) , and if so, may I take part? 2) Moderated-edit. I'm running Mailman on a couple of boxes but I also have a few hundred lists on a box running Lyris. I want to move them but one of the deal breakers at the moment is moderated-edit - the ability of a moderator to edit a message before it goes out. I personally don't use this feature for the lists I am the admin of but this seems to be a very important feature to some. An absolute must, in fact. I'm wonderig if this is in the cards, is it high on the priority list, should we expect to see it soon? I understand this is a non-paying gig for Barry and others, and I understand there are likely a ton of other items to deal with. But knowing what the priority and status of these two items are would give me a realistic idea of when I might be able to drop the oh-so-commercial Lyris. Finally, I'm not a Python programmer (yet), mostly Perl and PHP. But if I can help the cause in non-Python coding ways let me know. Thanks, Kevin

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Re: monthly notification error
by Eric D. Christensen 02 May '03

02 May '03

> I'm running debian/testing and just upgraded mailman to the version > in unstable (2.1.1-5). Last night the cron job to send out the monthly > password reminders failed with this error: > > Traceback (most recent call last): > File "/usr/lib/mailman/cron/mailpasswds", line 218, in ? > main() > File "/usr/lib/mailman/cron/mailpasswds", line 145, in main > password = mlist.getMemberPassword(member) > File "/var/lib/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 102, in > getMemberPassword > raise Errors.NotAMemberError, member > Mailman.Errors.NotAMemberError: rick(a)niof.net > > Is there some upgrade configuring I need to do? I did create the > 'mailman' mailing list. Do I need to add myself as a subscriber? > Should I send a bugreport to the debian maintainer? It's not just Debian... I'm running 2.1.1 on Linux and had the same problem. Probably worth filing a bug report against mailman since there are at least two of us seeing the same problems on different platforms now. I've also see this when running the cron/disabled script. It always seems to be with one specific user, which makes me suspect something that didn't translate correctly in the database. Attached below are the details I reported earlier. Barry - if it would be helpful, I'd be happy to give you access to the mailman account on my server so you can poke around. -- Eric D. Christensen <edc(a)proadmin.com> Proadmin, Inc. --- Attached Message Follows --- I'm getting an error when running cron/disabled after updating from 2.0 to 2.1.1. I suspect this is due to something that got corrupted / confused / boggled in the upgrade process, but I'm not finding any clues. Just wondering if anyone else had run into this before I devote time tracking it down (which could take awhile with my miserable python skills). This is from a list that has existing for several years and has survived though several mailman upgrades. I'm concerned that there my be rubbish in one of the pickled db files that might be causing other problems that I'm not aware of yet.... Traceback (most recent call last): File "../cron/disabled", line 209, in ? main() File "../cron/disabled", line 168, in main mlist.disableBouncingMember(member, info, msg) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 163, in disableBouncingMember self.sendNextNotification(member) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 243, in sendNextNotification {'listname' : self.real_name, File "/home/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 102, in getMemberPassword raise Errors.NotAMemberError, member Mailman.Errors.NotAMemberError: mosterbrink(a)saturnee.com The address in question IS a member, and interestingly enough, doesn't show as disabled form the admin interface or when running list_members --nomail. I also find in the error log: Apr 18 18:07:05 2003 (29034) Uncaught runner exception: mosterbrink(a)saturnee.comApr 18 18:07:05 2003 (29034) Traceback (most recent call last): File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 105, in _oneloop self._onefile(msg, msgdata) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/Runner.py", line 155, in _onefile keepqueued = self._dispose(mlist, msg, msgdata) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Queue/BounceRunner.py", line 126, in _dispose mlist.registerBounce(addr, msg) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 155, in registerBounce self.disableBouncingMember(member, info, msg) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 163, in disableBouncingMember self.sendNextNotification(member) File "/home/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 243, in sendNextNotification {'listname' : self.real_name, File "/home/mailman/Mailman/OldStyleMemberships.py", line 102, in getMemberPassword raise Errors.NotAMemberError, member NotAMemberError: mosterbrink(a)saturnee.com Apr 18 18:07:05 2003 (29034) SHUNTING: 1050714405.7204649+8f6a162efa552e48101820d5a680dba33c29e4c5 Anyone have any ideas?

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Ignoring "mail." in domain names
by Tom Neff 02 May '03

02 May '03

Another way we could really reduce moderator headaches would be to teach Mailman to try removing a leading "mail." in the domain part of the address if a member lookup fails. I get a lot of people who join lists as JSmith(a)splonk.edu and end up posting (immediately or six months later) as JSmith(a)mail.splonk.edu. If I had per-member aliases I could add them as needed, but this one case is so pervasive that it might make more sense to do it list-wide or even hard code it.

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Mails get lost with different 2.1.x mailmans, including today's CVS
by Tonu Samuel 02 May '03

02 May '03

New to this list but checked FAQ. Was not able to find solution. I am using mailman from CVS and this bug seems to be unfixed. Description: We are running company with 200 computer workstations and over 20 lists on mailman. Once our user was able to prove, that sometime mailman just deletes the subject. Instead of original subject we have "[foo] (no subject)". My first reaction was to upgrade mailman. I did "cvs update" and behaviour changed - no mails come through from this user. I believe after many tests I knopw what is the issue but I do not want to dig into Python code. Hope, someone else can fix it. We are located in Estonia and our native language uses some unique characters ä and õ (in HTML terms). At some point Microsoft invented new charset "Windows-1257" while actually "ISO8859-15" covers our needs. Many kind of software tries to interpret charsets and gets confused on pretty usual characters because this "windows-1257". I have no power to make different people change their country settings. Only way is to make software act different when unknown charset appears. Mailman currently "eats" characters with unknown charsets and this is bad for us. Original mail subject line in raw data: Subject: =?windows-1257?Q?FW:_=E4=E4test_kustutage_=E4ra?= And this makes mailman to loose mail. With latest version it archives mail without subject and never sends it out to subscribers. No error messages sent to anyone indicating mail loss. In some point it saved this mail in "shunt" folder but mail lost without any tracks after "unshunt" command. Any fixes? ideas? I propose to include bytes from unknown charsets in redistributed mails. If this seems not possible, read "windows-1257" as ISO8859-15 and I think it will work for most cases. -- Tonu Samuel <tonu(a)spam.ee>

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Subject: MTA assisted VERP (Postfix/Qmail)
by Colin Palmer 02 May '03

02 May '03

Just making my own announcment about these patches since tracker messages don't get posted to this list anymore. Firstly, the latest, I-think-it-actually-works-now release of the Qmail.py delivery handler: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=645513&group_id=103&atid=30… And, due to an enforced switch from Qmail to Postfix at work, here's a patch to SMTPDirect.py that does VERP in Postfix: http://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=731100&group_id=103&atid=30… Both have been tested in production and work for me. -- ** Colin Palmer, Systems and Development Group, University of Waikato, NZ **

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More tracebacks with mailman-cvs
by Marc MERLIN 02 May '03

02 May '03

I just did a CVS update again since I was still getting these, and one of my installs also dies on subscriptions Traceback (most recent call last): File "/var/local/mailman/scripts/driver", line 87, in run_main main() File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/subscribe.py", line 96, in main process_form(mlist, doc, cgidata, language) File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Cgi/subscribe.py", line 176, in process_form mlist.AddMember(userdesc, remote) File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/MailList.py", line 806, in AddMember cookie = Pending.new(Pending.SUBSCRIPTION, userdesc) File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 75, in new db = _load() File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 163, in _load return cPickle.load(fp) EOFError (go to http://lists.svlug.org/lists/listinfo/svlug and join if you want to reproduce) Thanks Marc ----- Forwarded message from Cron Daemon <root(a)svlug.org> ----- From: root(a)svlug.org (Cron Daemon) To: mailman(a)svlug.org X-Cron-Env: <SHELL=/bin/sh> X-Cron-Env: <HOME=/var/local/mailman> X-Cron-Env: <PATH=/usr/bin:/bin> X-Cron-Env: <LOGNAME=mailman> Subject: Cron <mailman@svlug> /usr/bin/python -S /var/local/mailman/cron/disabled Traceback (most recent call last): File "/var/local/mailman/cron/disabled", line 209, in ? main() File "/var/local/mailman/cron/disabled", line 201, in main mlist.sendNextNotification(member) File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Bouncer.py", line 212, in sendNextNotification Pending.confirm(info.cookie) File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 133, in confirm db = _load() File "/var/local/mailman/Mailman/Pending.py", line 163, in _load return cPickle.load(fp) EOFError ----- End forwarded message ----- -- "A mouse is a device used to point at the xterm you want to type in" - A.S.R. Microsoft is to operating systems & security .... .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ | Finger marc_f(a)merlins.org for PGP key

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Re: Mailman-Developers External user database
by Charlie Clark 02 May '03

02 May '03

On 2003-04-30 at 23:32:02 [+0200], mailman-developers-request(a)python.org wrote: > > 1) External user database. I'm sure you're all aware of the desire of > > some > > folks to have this. I found a Wiki document somewhere on the zope.org > > site that had discussions on this but I believe it was somewhat dated. > > Have any conclusions been reached with respect to the direction here? I > > think I read talk of a Zope-specific solution. I'm wondering if this > > means that we're likely never to see a Mailman that can talk to a MySQL > > database. I believe this one feature alone would elevate Mailman > > significantly. How hgh of a priority is this to the development team > > and what is the status? Are there current discussions on this somewhere > > other than the list (wiki boards, chats, what-have-you) , and if so, > > may I take part? > > See MemberAdapter in Mailman 2.1.x. As it happens, I'm currently writing > an advanced LDAP backend [ yes, I've see the other one :-) ]. We are currently using a generic RDBMS adapter which is available (commercially) from the developer; I assume there are others out there. This is a non-trivial piece of work so I think it may be a while before it is part of core mailman. I cannot recommend using MySQL for this because it will not enforce data integrity which is one of the key reasons for using an RDBMS in my view another being size: our lists are due to get very, very big (100.000 + users) I think Mailman's data store gets pretty bloated on such lists. Charlie

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where is this bounce message coming from
by Seth Galitzer 02 May '03

02 May '03

Greetings, A member of one of many lists I help manage recently got this rejection message: The message's content type was not explicitly allowed I do have content-filtering enabled on this list and have the following items in the pass_mime_types list: multipart/mixed multipart/alternative text/plain I do not have any items in the filter_mime_types list, convert_to_plaintext is set to Yes, and the filter_action is set to Reject. I had the user send me a copy of the message he tried to send. Reading the source of the message, it contained the following in the Content-Type header: multipart/related; type="multipart/alternative"; And then in subsequent mime sections it had parts with the following Content-Types: multipart/alternative text/plain text/html image/gif Now, it is my understanding, that with my current configuration, if any part has a mime-type that is not listed in the whitelist, that part is just dropped. Is that correct? Since the whole message was typed as multipart/related, did that cause the filters to behave differently? >From the docs: "Note this action is not taken if after filtering the message still contains content. In that case the message is always forwarded on to the list membership." Since there was at least one text/plain part and since I have also enabled plaintext conversion, shouldn't the message have gone on to the list anyway? I guess I'm just confused as to why this one got bounced. This is the first time a message has been bounced due to content filtering since we enabled the feature a month or so ago. On a related note, if I set the filter_action to Preserver instead of Reject, will the message go into the pending moderator request queue, or into a different queue? Just trying to sort things out. Seth -- Seth Galitzer sgsax(a)ksu.edu Computing Specialist http://puma.agron.ksu.edu/~sgsax Dept. of Plant Pathology Kansas State University

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