Mailman 3 August 2000 - Mailman-Developers

Re: [Mailman-Developers] Mailman password and administrative reminders
by Dan Mick 14 Aug '03

14 Aug '03

? This very message came to me with the following header: Errors-To: mailman-developers-admin(a)python.org All my bounces come to the list admin address, set in the admin webpage, in the second field of General Options. Do you have that set to something, and bounces still come to root? > 2. Bounces are sent to the poor postmaster instead of a -admin address. > I'm not entirely certain, but I think an Errors-To: header or something > like that in all Mailman messages might allow one to distribute that load > somewhat.

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Error in scripts/driver?
by Dan Mick 14 Sep '00

14 Sep '00

Actually, from comments in Defaults.py.in, it looks like that should have a from Mailman.Version import VERSION in it, so that importing Defaults or mm_cfg should get it...but I don't know how to use cvs log well enough to find out when the import was dropped from Defaults.py.in but it does look like a bug all right. > Looks like line 121 of scripts/driver needs to say > from Mailman.Version import VERSION > instead of > from Mailman.mm_cfg import VERSION > > Otherwise, I get ImportError during the traceback report.

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sugestion: http-digest
by dojai＠mail.ufv.br 31 Aug '00

31 Aug '00

This may seem a stupid sugestion, but since almost all lists have an archive: I was thinking why instead of receiving the traffic from the list as a digest (my case) why can't there be an option (other than text and mime) for just receiving an email with the URLs for each entry of the traffic of the day. Advantages: 1- would "send" each email on demand 2- I wouldn't receive big emails which I tend to trash instead of saving Disavantages: 1- greater http traffic 2- if I wanted to read the email a few days latter (not anymore in my cache) it would be a new request for the web page Eduardo J. Quirós B. (dojai(a)mail.ufv.br) "It's easier to ask for forgiveness than it is to get permission." (Rear Admiral Grace Murray Hopper)

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trimming extra headers; footer info in digests
by Brett Dikeman 31 Aug '00

31 Aug '00

So, after our switch off majordomo, I've received feedback from users. First, digest users complained that a lot of extra headers were making it tough to see the separation between messages. I also personally noticed that a -lot- of bandwidth is wasted by not stripping the footer of each message from the digest version(so the digest ends up with 20+ copies of the list's footer, with the list name and all.) Our list ballooned in bandwidth requirements when we went to mailman, and we're limited to an ISDN line. Alternatives like handing mail off to another server for expansion+delivery are not options at the moment; neither is a faster line(DSL is not available yet in the area where the server is.) I'd also like to know if there is a way to strip a lot of unnecessary headers, to save bandwidth and to make posts easier to read. Mainly, I don't see why we need listers(and especially digest users) to get much more than from, subject, to/cc, date, and reply-to if it's defined by the sender. Now, granted, there are strange setups, and it probably isn't compliant with some RFC thus-and-such to just hose headers, so it could be a non-default feature. However, I think that stripping each message of the mailman-addred footer -before- it is put in the digest would be great(just as how this is done with Pipermail archiving.) I would settle for this alone... Make sense? I've considered some kind of pre-processor program/script that takes a message and does stuff like: -remove unneeded headers -remove MIME/attachments -remove HMTL I'd guess that it's probably been done before, but a quick(and I do mean quick) search did not find anything. Brett PS:I should mention that people commented to me that they like the options/preferences, the archives, and -- ---- Brett Dikeman Systems Engineer CFN(formerly iClick, Inc) 914-872-8043 120 Bloomingdale Rd. 914-872-8100(fax) White Plains, NY 10605 http://www.iclick.com PGP Fingerprint: 06C2 5D5B D2B4 7626 BB24 2BBC 9E4A C8B3 PGP Key location: http://pdikeman.ne.mediaone.net/pgp/brett.pgp

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Re: [Mailman-Users] listmembers being "(ignored)", lockfile problems, 2.0b5
by J C Lawrence 31 Aug '00

31 Aug '00

On Wed, 30 Aug 2000 16:44:05 -0400 Brett Dikeman <brett(a)iclick.com> wrote: > Greetings. This is a edited version of a post I sent to the > developers this morning. No response, so I can only assume no one > cares to respond. At least have the good grace to wait a day or two. Not all of us read this list that quickly -- lately for instance I tend to read it only every couple days. I know others are in a similar circumstance and Barry has recently stated that he's buried in the Python 2.0 release and does not have much time to spend on the Mailman lists until that's done. > in logs/smtp-failure: What do your MTA's logs say? -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Work: claw(a)nuron.com http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

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Re: listmembers being "(ignored)", lockfile problems, 2.0b5
by Brett Dikeman 30 Aug '00

30 Aug '00

Sorry folks, I realized I never sent this to developers list, i owe you guys the same apology. <<<< At 1:48 PM -0700 8/30/00, Dan Mick wrote: > > This is a edited version of a post I sent to the developers this >> morning. No response, so I can only assume no one cares to respond. > >I don't know about everyone else, but I'm just now reading this >message. Don't expect paid-support-level service for a free software >product... Sorry Dan(and listers.) Didn't mean to give that impression. I've been under a lot of stress because I've got a lot(several hundred) unhappy campers who are all treating -me- like I'm paid support staff for our list(which is a list run by volunteers for Audi enthusiasts and owners, end shameless plug :-) So, it's hit a little close to home that I accidentally came off the same way. Part of my attitude was that I've emailed the developer list(and this list) before with no response whatsoever, not even a peep, whereas I usually get very quick(and good) responses from this list(actually, Dan, I just realized...you were the fellow who responded back to me within minutes around 4am a week or two back when I was in a similar stressed out situation :-) >>>> -- ---- Brett Dikeman Systems Engineer CFN(formerly iClick, Inc) 914-872-8043 120 Bloomingdale Rd. 914-872-8100(fax) White Plains, NY 10605 http://www.iclick.com PGP Fingerprint: 06C2 5D5B D2B4 7626 BB24 2BBC 9E4A C8B3 PGP Key location: http://pdikeman.ne.mediaone.net/pgp/brett.pgp

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listmembers being "(ignored)", lockfile problems, 2.0b5
by Brett Dikeman 30 Aug '00

30 Aug '00

Greetings. I realize this is the developer list, so I'll explain why I'm posting here and not there. I already posted there. I also searched through my archives. I couldn't search through the list archives because the search engine on python.org appears to be broken(and yes, I followed the instructions, choosing only SIG archives.) I found a bunch of posts related to my problems, but not much in the way of resolutions. So, I emailed the list with my particular flavor of the problem, and I have not received an answer back yet. My general impression is that the mailman-users list is -very- helpful for well-known, solved issues. In one case, I received a helpful reply back within minutes when I sent a message out at 4am EST. However, for anything new, the users list is pretty much not helpful, so I'm coming here. My hope is that this information will also help with developemnt of b6. The setup we're running is Solaris, with python 1.5.2 compiled myself. The list was working great, until people started loosing mail delivey. I thought the auto-bounce handler was removing people, but they're still listed as subscribed, and I never received a message from the bounce handler saying they would be removed. Now, what I'm seeing in the logs: in logs/smtp-failure: smtp-failure:Aug 30 11:16:15 2000 (122) -1 <email addr> (ignore) (many, many times) This user is in fact not getting email from either of the two lists he belongs to. The number in ()'s changes, though not with every entry in the logs. and, in logs/post, I see constant entries about: Aug 30 04:53:08 2000 (23571) post to <listname> from <listname>-request@<hostname>, size=28501, 177 failures (always the same number of failures and size; seems to be some sort of unrelated mail loop of some kind.) and there are posts that go through: Aug 30 04:44:42 2000 (23411) post to <listname> from <some subscriber's email address>, size=528, success Qrunner seems to be working: Aug 30 02:55:04 2000 (22304) qrunner begining Aug 30 02:55:09 2000 (22304) qrunner ended (this is repeated every time qrunner is launched, which is wasteful in terms of space since it runs once a minute; I've got 56k of text for less than 12 hours of running) Now, this mystery "177 failures" message shows up again: Aug 30 06:50:10 2000 (25068) All recipients refused: please run connect() first Aug 30 06:50:10 2000 (25068) smtp for 177 recips, completed in 2.620 seconds In logs/bounce, I'm not sure I understand the meanings: Aug 29 23:13:31 2000 (18077) <listname>: <someuser> - 27 more allowed over 426977 secs then there will be: Aug 29 23:13:33 2000 (18077) <listname>: <differentuser> - 0 more allowed over 395006 secs The non-delivery problem affects digest and non-digest users. Archives are working fine. One list is 1,500 people; 500 normal, 1000 digest users; the other is about 100 people, mostly non-digest. We're using sendmail, and I have the threaded delivery turned on due to the large number of slow/bad mail servers(and experience has shown that splitting them up into chunks results in a dramatic improvement in delivery times.) Thanks all for any help/tips. I wouldn't mind applying some patches that have been introduced since 2.0b5 that will fix this stuff, if they're available. Brett

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Error in scripts/driver?
by David Champion 29 Aug '00

29 Aug '00

Looks like line 121 of scripts/driver needs to say from Mailman.Version import VERSION instead of from Mailman.mm_cfg import VERSION Otherwise, I get ImportError during the traceback report. -- -D. dgc(a)uchicago.edu NSIT University of Chicago

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Re: [Mailman-Users] how to set clobber_date = 1 by default?
by Dan Mick 29 Aug '00

29 Aug '00

> > One can always change Archiver.py for one's installation, I suppose. > > Yeah, works for now. Of course, the next upgrade will blow it away... A useful hint: if you make a CVS tree, then you can change your local file and 99% of the time just forget about it. I finally got religion and did this, and it turns out that, if Barry changes a file I've changed, most of the time CVS merges it correctly and automatically. For a change like this, it will certainly be correct. That has the other advantage of being on the bleeding edge if you want to (you can always check out the Last Tarball Version if you want using symbolic tags)

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Re: [Mailman-Users] how to set clobber_date = 1 by default?
by Marc MERLIN 29 Aug '00

29 Aug '00

On Mon, Aug 28, 2000 at 06:11:12PM -0700, Dan Mick wrote: > > Did I miss anything or is that option absent? > > Right; in fact Archiver.py says: > > # Not configurable > self.clobber_date = 0 I changed this to 1, which will work until I upgrade mailman :-) > > Can we please have mm 2.0 not trust the MUA for date at archiving time by > > default when lists are created? > > Speaking solely for myself, I'd rather not, but I can see room for > debate. I'm just tired of people creating random web pages because their date is messed up. It really looks silly. Besides, you typically get messages within minutes of them being sent, so the local date should be really close to the actual sent date. > At least it would be nice to have it in mm_cfg.py. Yep :-) > One can always change Archiver.py for one's installation, I suppose. Yeah, works for now. Of course, the next upgrade will blow it away... Thanks, Marc -- Microsoft is to software what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/ (friendly to non IE browsers) Finger marc_f(a)merlins.org for PGP key and other contact information

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