Mailman 3 December 2013 - Mailman-Developers

before next release: disable backscatter in default installation
by Jo Rhett Nov. 7, 2022

Nov. 7, 2022

Hi. There's a fairly simple problem here that needs to be addressed. And it's mostly a documentation/install problem. I'm hoping we can get this resolved before the next release. PROBLEM: Mailman comes out of the box ready to backscatter spam people. Yes, it's easy enough to fix. But because it comes stock this way, and is documented to install this way, most people install it to do this. Those of us who work in abuse departments are tired of hearing "well that's how Mailman works". We also object to having to teach people how to fix their mailman installations because it's not documented in the current manual. This is *exactly* like Sendmail 14 years ago. We didn't accept it then, and Sendmail fixed the problem. RESOLUTION: Mailman default installation should not backscatter in a default configuration. 1. Don't create backscatter aliases for subscribe/unsubscribe/etc by default. Nearly everyone uses web based signup. 2. Discard or hold messages from non-subscribers by default. I would think that it would be perfectly reasonable to have documentation on how to enable the 1980s-style -request / -subscribe etc aliases. However this documentation should have a note that this is against the AUP of nearly every network provider, and enabling it will likely cause them to get listed in various blacklists as a backscatter source. FYI: I know that this goes against the instincts of many old-time mailing list advocates here. But after dealing with a 10k/hour backscatter DoS my tolerance for this problem is understandably limited. Yes, it was a sweet day back in the 1980s. I was running a mailing list server and several UUCP gateways at the time, so I remember them well. But those days are past, and we need to deal with the reality of today. -- Jo Rhett Net Consonance : consonant endings by net philanthropy, open source and other randomness

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Mailman 3 vs Groupserver vs Sympa
by Ian Eiloart March 14, 2014

March 14, 2014

Hi Kẏra, Some additional answers, inline below. Most of your questions relate to the web archiver, and Nico has answered some of those. In order to get all the questions and answers in the same place (so people can see which questions aren’t yet answered here), I’ve rolled Nico’s comments into this reply. On 7 Oct 2013, at 03:38, Kẏra <kxra(a)riseup.net> wrote: > Hello, > > My name is Kẏra and I am the technology director of the Free Culture > Foundation as well as a campaigns organizer for the Free Software > Foundation and we're in need up upgrading our mailing lists to a more > web-friendly system. I'm doing research on newer list severs to see how > they compare. So far Groupserver seems to provide everything, but if > Mailman 3 is going to be released soon, we'd like to consider that as well. > > I'm making a comparison chart and wanted to ask about Mailman 3 (and > Postorius) features. Answers to any and all of the following with regards > to Mailman 3 + Postorius would be super helpful: > > Can you post from the web interface? yes > Is there file upload support? yes > Is there now a search feature? Can it search multiple lists? yes, yes > Are there web feeds (atom or rss)? Generated from lists? searches? threads? > files? Nico’s plugin API seems to be offering support for this. > Are posts and administration integrated into the web interface? I think that site and list administration are not part of the hyperkitty > Can you specify a posting rate restriction? I don’t know. > Is full css customization for the web interface supported? > Is css customization for the email interface supported? Hyperkitty supports "themes". I’m guessing you’ll be able to roll your own. > Is there site-side logging? (as opposed to server side) Logging (apart from web accesses) would be a Mailman responsibility. I’m not sure what you mean by "site-side", but perhaps you’re after remote reporting on a domain of yours hosted a third party at a remote site. Again, that’s possible. It could be provided through a web interface, or some other means. > Is there a link to the post in the web interface in the footer of messages? That’ll require co-operation between Mailman and the web archive. But, if the web archive URL is predictable, then I think Mailman will be able to do this. > Now that users are more than just email addresses, can you request to > contact a list member? Do you mean from their profile page, or from a list of members? > Can users have multiple email addresses? Yes, that’s a part of users being more than just email addresses. > Are there profile pages where you can see a summary of their latest posts? yes > Can the web interface hide quoted text? yes > Are usage statistics provided? The Hyperkitty change log for 0.1 alpha says "show basic list info and metrics". Certainly the Mailman 2 logs provide enough information from which useful usage stats could be derived. If Hyperkitty doesn’t provide the stats that you want, you’ll likely be able to get them from the log files. > Thanks! > > Also, did Mailman 2 already support LMTP and virtual domains or are those > new? They’re new. Mailman 2 did have partial support of virtual domains, but there was a restriction whereby no two domains could have a list with the same name: so I can’t imagine that this would be useful. > > Best, > Kẏra > > -- > Board of Directors, Free Culture Foundation: www.freeculture.org > Campaigns Organizer, Free Software Foundation: www.fsf.org > > Blog: http://kxra.info - StatusNet Microblog: http://identi.ca/kxra > Email: kxra(a)freeculture.org - SMS: +1.617.340.3661 > Jabber/XMPP: kxra(a)riseup.net - IRC: kxra @freenode @oftc @indymedia > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers(a)python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-developers%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/iane%40sussex.ac… > > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 -- Ian Eiloart Postmaster, University of Sussex +44 (0) 1273 87-3148

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Migration script from MM2 to MM3
by Barry Warsaw Jan. 15, 2014

Jan. 15, 2014

On Sep 20, 2013, at 12:46 PM, Aurelien Bompard wrote: >What do you think? Bad timing? Any existing work I'm missing? I think it's a *great* idea. No, perfect timing. Not that I know of! :) What we've said in the past is that we weren't going to promise conversion scripts from 2.1 to 3.0, partly because that work was incomplete, but also because we wanted to caution users not to just blindly upgrade as soon as 3.0 is released. But I think having a reliable, well-tested, non-destructive option to upgrade would be wonderful, especially because I fully hope that a site could run 2.1 and 3.0 together for a while. Any help you need, let me know. (I've been ridiculously swamped at work these past few weeks. Apologies for being rather quiet lately. I hope that'll improve in the next couple of weeks.) Cheers, -Barry

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bug in tests/test_handlers.py
by Stephen Willey Mats Mats Dec. 20, 2013

Dec. 20, 2013

with http://bazaar.launchpad.net/~mailman-coders/mailman/2.1/revision/1376 “ Setting digest_size_threshhold to zero now means no digests will be sent based on size instead of a digest being sent with every post. “ tests/test_handlers.py sets digest_size_threshhold to 0. I assume this is an attempt to force the digest send. But now 0 means ‘no digest’. Below is my proposed patch to trick ToDigest into sending. steve --- /usr/local/mailman/tests/test_handlers.py.old 2013-12-19 11:57:09.745503688 -0800 +++ /usr/local/mailman/tests/test_handlers.py 2013-12-19 11:26:18.325853268 -0800 @@ -1880,7 +1880,7 @@ Here is message %(i)d msg = self._makemsg(99) print msg size = os.path.getsize(self._path) + len(str(msg)) - mlist.digest_size_threshhold = 0 + mlist.digest_size_threshhold = .001 ToDigest.process(mlist, msg, {}) files = self._sb.files() # There should be two files in the queue, one for the MIME digest and

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Possible bug in marilman arch when doing incremental archiving
by Mark Sapiro Dec. 18, 2013

Dec. 18, 2013

On 12/13/2013 05:06 AM, fc lists wrote: > > When the start is higher then counter, to iterate over the mailbox and get > to the starting point requested, the *next()* method on the mbox object is > called which trigger the archfactory which extract the attachment from > messages that were already archived causing the duplicate attachment to > happen. > > My "test fix" is basically to set the factory for the mbox object to the > default rfc822.Message while iterating over the mbox object until the start > is reached , then i set the factory back to the _archfactory ... and > everything seems to work as expected. Thank you for the report. I have created <https://bugs.launchpad.net/mailman/+bug/1260883> for this issue. I think your fix is OK, but I am inclined to set the factory while skipping to the start to Mailman.Mailbox._safeparser rather than the default just in case one of the skipped messages throws MessageParseError. -- Mark Sapiro <mark(a)msapiro.net> The highway is for gamblers, San Francisco Bay Area, California better use your sense - B. Dylan

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Possible bug in marilman arch when doing incremental archiving
by fc lists Dec. 13, 2013

Dec. 13, 2013

Hi, I think i encountered a bug for mailman *arch* process when doing incremental archiving out of band from mbox file. I am running mailman-2.1.9 (working on upgrading to 2.1.17 ... but if i got this right it is still present in that version) For various reasons i need to run my Archiving out of band from the normal mailman pipeline. So i set mailman to only archive to MBOX file and then i regularly run the *arch* command using "-s" and "-e" option to define my incremental The issue i have been having is that at every single time the *arch *command is called after the first "wipe" then i get a duplicate of every single attachment file that was previously created from messages already archived. I followed up into the code and i think i found the issue, but i wanted to confirm here that i did not miss anything else or just got on the wrong road. (i am not a developer whatsoever) in lib/mailman/Mailman/Mailbox.py (line 79 and following on my code) an *archfactory* is defined for the MBOX file that will be opened. *def _archfactory(mailbox): * which return the scrubber which extract the attachment from the email. the factory is called on the message extracted every time the *next()*method is called on the mbox object in lib/mailman/Mailman/pipermail.py where the actual logic of arch -s X -e X is defined the code look like (line 555 on my code): def processUnixMailbox(self, input, start=None, end=None): mbox = ArchiverMailbox(input, self.maillist) if start is None: start = 0 counter = 0 while counter < start: try: * m = mbox.next()* except Errors.DiscardMessage: continue if m is None: return counter += 1 When the start is higher then counter, to iterate over the mailbox and get to the starting point requested, the *next()* method on the mbox object is called which trigger the archfactory which extract the attachment from messages that were already archived causing the duplicate attachment to happen. My "test fix" is basically to set the factory for the mbox object to the default rfc822.Message while iterating over the mbox object until the start is reached , then i set the factory back to the _archfactory ... and everything seems to work as expected. Again, i am no developer and i wanted to double check this here before i go on and put this live on my systems. Thanks Francesco Ciocchetti

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mailman3 API and workflow
by nicolas Dec. 11, 2013

Dec. 11, 2013

Hello, I have the following use case : an unregistered user sends a mail to list, accepted by moderators, then i see it's adress inserted in the address table but no entry is created in the user table. when using mailman client to 'get' the user's profile using email as key, it answers 404 user not found, and when i'm trying create_user routine, I have : HTTPError: HTTP Error 400: Address already exists: It's either a bug at recieve/accept which should not insert or some bug in api for creating user or maybe i'm wrong using the API, or missing some doc, somewhere... would appreciate help (or fix directives) Regards

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probleme install
by Smati Beghoura Dec. 7, 2013

Dec. 7, 2013

Hello, I'm French. The following text was translated with Google Translate. Allow me to contact you because I have a problem in the configuration mailman / postfix. I have a new server. Config: I am under release3 CentOS 6.4 + webmin. I asked a technician to deal with the migration of my sites from the old server to it, but unfortunately, even if the sites work now, he somewhat "broken" the distrib. So that I had no mailman. So I decided to remove and reinstall mailman. Mailman now works with a list (mailman default) + newsletter. Postfix on, if I send myself an email through Outlook postmaster(a)hellovoyance.com reserved area on postfix) I get well email. However, if I send an email to the list (newsletter(a)hellovoyance.com) Outlook me a mail with return "user unknown". The detail of this is as follows: Reporting-MTA: dns; ns2275743.ovh.net X-Postfix-Queue-ID: 5521962ED9 X-Postfix-Sender: rfc822; postmaster(a)hellovoyance.com Arrival-Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2013 11:58:54 +0100 (CET) Final-Recipient: rfc822; newsletter(a)hellovoyance.com Original-Recipient: rfc822;newsletter(a)hellovoyance.com Action: failed Status: 5.1.1 Diagnostic-Code: x-unix; user unknow I would like your opinion, because I admit that I am lost. I am novice but trying to do it myself with the means that are given to me. Thanking you in advance for your reply Regards SmatiBeghoura PS: if I must re-install, how to remove mailman properly and with precise installation documentation with my current setup? PPS: for information, there is also a database whose name is "mail". On this basis, there is the following tables: "admin", "alias", "alias_domain", "config", "domain, "domain_admins", "fetchmail", "log", "mailbox", "mailing", "quota", "quota2", "vacation" " vacation_notification"

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Pecan
by Barry Warsaw Dec. 5, 2013

Dec. 5, 2013

Does anybody here have experience with Pecan? http://pecanpy.org/index.html -Barry

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Problem with runner logger with unicode
by nicolas Dec. 3, 2013

Dec. 3, 2013

Hi, I encountered a subtil problem when a component logs unicode strings (present case was the hyperkitty archiver) : (py27)mailman@mail:~$ Traceback (most recent call last): File "/home/mailman/mailman/src/mailman/core/logging.py", line 76, in emit msg = self.format(record) File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 723, in format return fmt.format(record) File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 464, in format record.message = record.getMessage() File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 328, in getMessage msg = msg % self.args UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xc2 in position 21: ordinal not in range(128) Logged from file runner.py, line 261 Traceback (most recent call last): File "/home/mailman/mailman/src/mailman/core/logging.py", line 76, in emit msg = self.format(record) File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 723, in format return fmt.format(record) File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 464, in format record.message = record.getMessage() File "/usr/lib/python2.7/logging/__init__.py", line 328, in getMessage msg = msg % self.args UnicodeDecodeError: 'ascii' codec can't decode byte 0xc2 in position 2982: ordinal not in range(128) Logged from file runner.py, line 264 then found how to fix it : === modified file 'src/mailman/core/runner.py' --- src/mailman/core/runner.py 2013-12-01 13:28:49 +0000 +++ src/mailman/core/runner.py 2013-12-03 10:47:56 +0000 @@ -258,10 +258,10 @@ self.switchboard.enqueue(msg, msgdata) def _log(self, exc): - elog.error('Uncaught runner exception: %s', exc) + elog.error(b'Uncaught runner exception: %s', exc) s = StringIO() traceback.print_exc(file=s) - elog.error('%s', s.getvalue()) + elog.error(b'%s', s.getvalue()) def _clean_up(self): """See `IRunner`.""" unless it can be considered as a problem in the component itself... But (personal thought) mailman's stability may not depend of third party components... I can propose a merge for it if it's revelant (just have to go deeper into lp/bzr) Cheers Nico

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