Mailman 3 February 2015 - Mailman-Developers

Re: [Mailman-Developers] Postorius test debugging problem : tests_forms.py
by Abhilash Raj 27 Feb '15

27 Feb '15

Hi Pranjal, I was able to run the tests in ListNewTest, and kind of debug the other test too. In ListNewTest you have two tests doing the same thing, probably you intended at doing something else, but there is nothing in there right now. there is a method of django forms called as `errors`. So you can simply do print form.errors and get the actual error in the forms printed when you run the tests. When I ran that I got "Passwords are not identical" error. Then I saw you changed the `clean` method in UserNew to `clean_password`. According to django documentation[1] when you are trying to access more than one field for cleaning you have to use `clean` method and not `clean_<fieldname>` method. Like `clean_email` method is cool! If you print the errors for `test_form_fields_listname` method, you'd see that it says that 'mailman.most-desirable.org' is not a valid choice. So you need to first create a domain with that host in `setUp` method of `ListNewTest`. I hope that helps! [1]: https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.7/ref/forms/validation/ On 20 February 2015 at 07:26, Pranjal Yadav <godricglow(a)gmail.com> wrote: > I started writing tests to improve the coverage for postorius and I ran > into few problems which I couldn't solve for past few days. I added few new > test cases and re-ran tox. It seems somehow none of the tests ran although > the tox output says "ran 11 tests in 72.332s, failures = 3" > > Here is the link to my tests : http://pastebin.com/1jLhVsr2 > I did change a few things in forms.py : http://pastebin.com/2P3vXW7W > > After running these tests I realized UserNewTest and ListNewTest never > runs, though tox outputs it ran 11 test and failed 3 (mainly the assertTrue > for listname, password and email methods), when I tried tox -e > py27-django1.7 -- postorius.tests.test_forms.UserNewTest, it says 0 tests > ran in 0.001s > > 1) So I don't understand why the assertTrue validation is failing though > all the inputs to the form is prefect? I talked to Aurelien and Abhliash > and also followed ( > https://docs.djangoproject.com/en/1.7/ref/forms/validation/#validating-fiel…) > however it left me with the same situation. > > 2) If the tests run with tox then why do they not run when a particular > testcase is tested? > > 3) I discussed this problem with Aurelien and he mentioned "Form class > shouldn't do anything in its __init__ function" however we do have __inti__ > functions in our forms.py. So do we need to modify something there? > > -- > *Pranjal Yadav* > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers(a)python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-developers%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/raj.abhilash1%40… > > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 -- thanks, Abhilash Raj

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] GSoC 2015: brainstorming ideas suitable for beginners?
by Stephen J. Turnbull 27 Feb '15

27 Feb '15

Ankush Sharma B.Tech. Electronics Engg, IIT(BHU), Varanasi (U.P.), INDIA writes: > Spamming would be the case when you are sending the emails to people who > don't want to receive such emails. While if we control the <email> variable > to take value from the set of emails of the list members only and not > allowing the use of template variables i.e < .. > stuff in the *To: *field. Ah, but Mailman is a winning application because it's easy to add and remove subscribers. You can already upload files in the "mass add" screen of subscription management. If you're going to work on Mailman, remember the first rule of mail abuse: RULE #1: All mail programs can be used to spam. That said, I'm pretty sure people are already using Mailman for spamming in exactly that way (uploading files of target addresses), and there are some features like headers and footers that could be adapted to "personalized" spam. I don't see why the good guys should be prevented from using features that the bad guys have anyway. So I don't consider the smells like spam, tastes like spam, argument prohibitive (although I sympathize with Terri). > >> And I have a spreadsheet data on the mailing list server like this: > >> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cAbdSmc1NA-C9IZFjc_ > >> zB67qEvgmX8Jr3xYyGxPdwdU/pubhtml > >> > >> Mailman can have a functionality of flooding the /template/ by > >> using the spreadsheet data. The variables in the /template/ (< > >> -- > stuff) would be replaced by the corresponding row data in > >> the spreadsheet corresponding to the emails of the list > >> members. This can provide great flexibility to mailman users who > >> use mailman as announcement list. To be honest, this application would not be very high on my list of interesting projects. In the business application you described, I would be just as happy sending the table of assignments to everybody (and if there are assigned time slots, it doubles as the program). On the other hand, for marketing mail shots I would typically want a more flexible program. For example, if a customer has children and I know their names, then I would insert a whole paragraph about them, including their names, and probably the text would depend on gender and hobbies and so on. Or consider a cellphone service, the customer might be a family with several members and phones, and your letter probably should treat each member appropriately recommending upgrades according to usage patterns and demographics. That doesn't fit well into the rectangular spreadsheet model of row per message. I think that perhaps a more general database that *can* read spreadsheets but is not limited to that model would be more appropriate. But that is likely to be a fairly big project unless you're quite familiar with this kind of object-oriented database. Regards,

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] GSoC 2015: brainstorming ideas suitable for beginners?
by Terri Oda 26 Feb '15

26 Feb '15

Honestly, I don't love this idea. I would be technically feasible with VERP, but it edges into features that are very popular for people sending spam. On 2015-02-26 11:32 PM, Ankush Sharma B.Tech. Electronics Engg, IIT(BHU), Varanasi (U.P.), INDIA wrote: > How about having personalized announcement mailing lists ? > > A personalized mailing list will allow mailman users to send > personalized emails to all the list members from a common email > template. Suppose I am the manager of a company and I need to ask all > the workers for a meeting. I want each of my workers to prepare a topic > to speak on during the meeting. For this I need to send each of them a > message separately mentioning the topic he/she has to speak on. > > Suppose the email /template/ is like this: > > *To : <worker-email>* > *Subject: <sub>* > * > * > *Hello <worker-name>,* > * > * > *Hope you are having fun at <worker-place>. I am arranging a meeting at > 5 p.m. on Saturday. I want you to speak on <topic> during the meeting. > So, come prepared for that.* > *<other-suff>* > * > * > *Best wishes,* > * > * > *Ankush Sharma* > *Manager* > *foo-bar* > > > And I have a spreadsheet data on the mailing list server like this: > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1cAbdSmc1NA-C9IZFjc_zB67qEvgmX8Jr3xY… > > Mailman can have a functionality of flooding the /template/ by using the > spreadsheet data. The variables in the /template/ (< -- > stuff) would > be replaced by the corresponding row data in the spreadsheet > corresponding to the emails of the list members. This can provide great > flexibility to mailman users who use mailman as announcement list. > > Later on, mailman can have the functionality of saving email templates > and choosing one of them in a certain scenario. Mailing lists can be > made more personalized and powerful in this way. > > Expecting further feedback or suggestions on this idea. > > Ankush Sharma > IIT-BHU,Varanasi > github.com/black-perl <http://github.com/black-perl> > > > > On Thu, Feb 26, 2015 at 4:40 AM, Barry Warsaw <barry(a)list.org > <mailto:barry@list.org>> wrote: > > On Feb 25, 2015, at 04:12 PM, Andrew Stuart wrote: > > >I’m looking forward to being able to set and get domainowner and serverowner > >(or siteowner or whatever its called). It will allow me to delete lots of > >code and there’s no greater joy than deleting code. > > > >Are you anticipating this will be in V3.0? > > Please file a bug and we'll see. ;) > > Cheers, > -Barry > > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers(a)python.org <mailto:Mailman-Developers@python.org> > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Searchable Archives: > http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-developers%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: > https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/ankush.sharma.ec… > > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > >

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Ideas for injecting test messages
by Stephen J. Turnbull 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

Abhilash Raj writes: > Questions and answers seperated by a 3 hour window makes me feel > like its not even a question, Maybe we should add "suppress threads with self-responses" to Aanand's list of plugins? :-) (@Aanand -- it's impossible, so this is just a joke.) > If anyone feels this was totally unnecessary, please correct me. I don't think Andrew has been abusive, just enthusiastic. That's just a data point to say "YMMV but I had barely noticed". If I were bothered, I probably would have mailed him personally rather than posting to the net, or asked Barry and Mark out of band if something should be said. That said, self-replies should be *very* rare according to traditional netiquette, and generally restricted to (1) corrections of substantive errors in the query, and (2) the summary followup to "reply-to set to me; will summarize" posts. On the whole Internet, netiquette is changing. However, Mailman is an *old* project, and most of the active developers have been around for quite some time (though I daresay none of us remember a time without FORTRAN or LISP), and we are most comfortable with the Emily Postnews (remember her? probably not, you need to be *old* and listening on port 119 :-) version of netiquette. BTW, I *am* attempting to channel Barry and Mark, though with what success they'll need to say. I don't mean to criticize any person's behavior (IMO so far all has been compatible with the netiquette I believe is practiced on this list). I think it's worth having a public discussion *right now*, because we're coming up on GSoC and we'll have a pile of newbies coming in. (At least, I hope so!) It's best if we have a common policy. IMHO FWIW YMMV and we'll all adjust our watches to Barry's, of course. Regards, Steve

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Ideas for injecting test messages
by Andrew Stuart 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

Perhaps. I’m working close to full time on programming with Mailman and questions do come up. I’ve had no previous experience of Mailman and for the most part I feel do all my own research and problem resolution. I dig deep into the source and generally I think I ask questions when I’ve got to the bottom of the source code and still can’t understand why something is working in the way it does. I know I’m more active on the list at the moment than anyone else. However, this is the only case that I’m aware of that I’ve asked a question that some research on Google could have answered. If you’d like less activity that’s OK I’ll take that on board. This however is likely to be the outcome of Mailman 3 coming to completion with interfaces that others programmers can work with- active development along with lots of questions. The whole Mailman community is likely to become more noisy if you have succeeded in your goal of building something valuable, which I think is true. I’ll take feedback from anyone on this - I don’t mind hearing what people think. If you feel like you’d like the list to be less active from me that’s fine - if you think my questions lack research and effort that’s OK too. Just let me know. as On 25 Feb 2015, at 10:18 pm, Abhilash Raj <raj.abhilash1(a)gmail.com> wrote: Hi Andrew, I am not sure how do I put this, but I think you should spend little more time investigating about the questions you send in to this list. Questions and answers seperated by a 3 hour window makes me feel like its not even a question, but a personel log. I agree mailman-devs can answer your queries more quickly, but if you can find answers from documentation then there is no point in sending in these queries. It would be easier if you collated your queries and send-in one email in a day or two? Also, I really appriciate the authentication proxy that you are trying to build for mailman, please don't take this as any form of discouragement. These are my personel thoughts and in no way the opinion of the whole mailman community. If anyone feels this was totally unnecessary, please correct me. On 25 February 2015 at 07:57, Andrew Stuart <andrew.stuart(a)supercoders.com.au> wrote: > Please disregard. Apparently there’s websites that let you search the Internet, through which I found: > > https://pythonhosted.org/mailman/src/mailman/commands/docs/inject.html > > > On 25 Feb 2015, at 10:04 am, Andrew Stuart <andrew.stuart(a)supercoders.com.au> wrote: > > I want to inject some test messages into Mailman to test moderation functions via the REST API. > > Any ideas on a simple way to do that? > > Ideally I need to be able to clear them out somehow too. > > thanks > > as > > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers(a)python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-developers%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/andrew.stuart%40… > > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 > > _______________________________________________ > Mailman-Developers mailing list > Mailman-Developers(a)python.org > https://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/mailman-developers > Mailman FAQ: http://wiki.list.org/x/AgA3 > Searchable Archives: http://www.mail-archive.com/mailman-developers%40python.org/ > Unsubscribe: https://mail.python.org/mailman/options/mailman-developers/raj.abhilash1%40… > > Security Policy: http://wiki.list.org/x/QIA9 -- thanks, Abhilash Raj

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Ideas for injecting test messages
by Andrew Stuart 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

I want to inject some test messages into Mailman to test moderation functions via the REST API. Any ideas on a simple way to do that? Ideally I need to be able to clear them out somehow too. thanks as

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] Approach for plugin ideas
by Aanand Shekhar Roy 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

Hi Abhilash, Thanks for guiding me through. I'll work on the details as suggested by you. :) > Hi Aanand, > > On 23 February 2015 at 17:11, Aanand Shekhar Roy <2013001(a)iiitdmj.ac.in> > wrote: >> Hi everyone, >> >> This is my approach for plug-in ideas : >> >> BANNED WORDS: >> 1. We create a common set of words that are to be banned in a mail. > > How do you create such a list, who decides which words are banned? > Will this list be list specific or global to one mailman installation? > Would it be possible to add/remove words from these lists from postorius? > >> 2. In list settings we create an option for list admin to choose action >> taken if a mail has banned words. > > What according to you should be sane default for this? Is is possible that > the banned words be removed or replaced with ****** and the mail be sent > to > the list so as to ease the life of list-admins? > >> 3. We need to create a new rule in mailman/src/mailman/rules that checks >> for banned words in a msg string. > > When you mention url relative to a project, you don't need to add the name > of > the root directory. Like 'mailman/src/mailman/rules' should be > 'src/mailman/rules/'. > Also, include them inside quotes to differentiate it from normal text. > >> 4. This rule is to be implemented in >> mailman/src/mailman/chains/builtin.py >> where it takes the action as chosen by list admin and then the control >> is >> passed further depending on the action taken. >> >> CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION CHECK: >> 1. We need to create another rule which check for confidential info. >> like >> phone no and address credit card no. using regexp search. > > How do you do that check? How can you differentiate any number from > phone number, > or credit card number? (Using reg-ex, yes, but what would the rules be?) > Why is address a confidential information and how do you actually decide > what > level of confidentiality you want to maintain? Will that be > configurable per-list or > globally in a mailman installation? > >> 2. If found we hold that message, and then we send an auto-reply to >> sender >> asking for confirmation if he >> intends to post such information. >> 3. This system works similar to the mail-back verification procedure >> during confirmation of email while subscribing where potential >> subscriber's reply decides the further action to be taken. > > How will you parse the response of the sender, will there be a > pre-defined format > like email commands in mailman? Will you provide option in postorius too > for the > same? If yes, how? > >> 4.Based on the user's response the held message will be processed >> further. > > Where will the message be stored while mailman waits for the reply > from the sender? > Will there be a timeout for response after which the email will > automatically be > rejected (or discarded? ) or will mailman wait forever for the > response? If you plan > to timeout what would be default value? > >> TIMED VACATION: >> In member's preference form we already have an option for enabling and >> disabling mail delivery. We can >> extend it to another option called "Vacation period" which takes the >> duration of vacation and disables receiving emails and >> automatically enables mails after the vacation period ends. > > This project is about *plugins* and not extending core to do such things. > Once it is decided what and how the filtering is to be done, its fairly > easy to > write a rule. What you need to figure out is how to actually add this as > an > optional plug-in to mailman. If you make the options configurable by > list-admin > you would need to add options in postorius as well, again as a plug-in. > > Have you read if mailman supports plug-ins at all right now? If yes, how? > If no, > how will you do that? You have suggested 4 ideas for plugins, but I > think it would > be better if you choose any two of them which you can best implement in > the time > frame given to you. In case you finish early, you can extend your > project and create > more plugins. > > I hope my questions help you figure out the minute details of your > project. > > thanks, > Abhilash >

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Approach for plugin ideas
by Aanand Shekhar Roy 25 Feb '15

25 Feb '15

Hi everyone, This is my approach for plug-in ideas : BANNED WORDS: 1. We create a common set of words that are to be banned in a mail. 2. In list settings we create an option for list admin to choose action taken if a mail has banned words. 3. We need to create a new rule in mailman/src/mailman/rules that checks for banned words in a msg string. 4. This rule is to be implemented in mailman/src/mailman/chains/builtin.py where it takes the action as chosen by list admin and then the control is passed further depending on the action taken. CONFIDENTIAL INFORMATION CHECK: 1. We need to create another rule which check for confidential info. like phone no and address credit card no. using regexp search. 2. If found we hold that message, and then we send an auto-reply to sender asking for confirmation if he intends to post such information. 3. This system works similar to the mail-back verification procedure during confirmation of email while subscribing where potential subscriber's reply decides the further action to be taken. 4.Based on the user's response the held message will be processed further. TIMED VACATION: In member's preference form we already have an option for enabling and disabling mail delivery. We can extend it to another option called "Vacation period" which takes the duration of vacation and disables receiving emails and automatically enables mails after the vacation period ends. AUTO-MODERATION SYSTEM FOR LIMITING POST: I want your suggestions on how to approach this issue. Also,I wish to seek your views on these approaches.

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/3.0/addresses/cris@example.com/user' - multi purpose REST API method
by Andrew Stuart 24 Feb '15

24 Feb '15

TLDR - This API methods does multiple things and depends on information apart from the URL to define its behaviour mode, making it hard to give a clear authentication scope to. I wonder if it should be broken out into individual REST API methods, each with a single purpose and a clear authentication scope. As background information, from the documentation: “”"To link an address to a user, a POST request can be sent to the ``/user`` sub-resource of the address. If the user does not exist, it will be created.””" >>> dump_json('http://localhost:9001/3.0/addresses/cris@example.com/user', ... {'display_name': 'Cris X. Person’}) My question is - I am interested to understand the thinking behind this REST method. It is effectively a multi purpose method. In one case it *creates an email address* and *creates a new user* and which are linked to each other. In one case it *creates an email address* and links that address to an existing user, when given a POSTed user_id. In one case it *creates an email address* and does not link it to any user, if the auto_create POST option is False. In terms of building an authentication system this REST method is problematic. All (I think at this stage anyway) other methods in the REST API can be given a clear authentication scope/role based only on the URL. This REST API method, dual to its multi purpose, mode options-in-the-POST-data behaviour, cannot be given an authentication scope based only on the URL. Each of the above behaviours have a different authentication scope/role. For example: (permitted by superuser only) In one case it *creates an email address* and *creates a new user* and which are linked to each other. (permitted by superuser only, permitted by existing user) In one case it *creates an email address* and links that address to an existing user, when given a POSTed user_id. (permitted by superuser only) In one case it *creates an email address* and does not link it to any user, if the auto_create POST option is False. I’m interested to hear thoughts on this. It would be good if the authentication scope of every REST API URL could be defined based only on the URL, without the need to know either options provided in the form data, or whether or not other records such as user records exist. In summary - This API methods does too many things and depends on information apart from the URL to define its behaviour, making it hard to give a clear authentication scope to. I wonder if it should be broken out into individual REST API methods, each with a single purpose and a clear authentication scope.

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Is there a direct way to create an address via the REST API?
by Andrew Stuart 24 Feb '15

24 Feb '15

I can create an address that is not linked to a user by 1: creating a user with an address 2: unlinking the address from the user Is there a more direct route to creating an address via REST? I thought there was a POST /addresses method but I can’t seem to see it now - maybe it was never there. thanks as

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