Mailman 3 July 2000 - Mailman-Developers

Re: [Mailman-Developers] lowercase listnames?
by J C Lawrence 26 Jul '00

26 Jul '00

On Tue, 25 Jul 2000 21:12:21 -0700 (PDT) Darrell Fuhriman <darrell(a)grumblesmurf.net> wrote: > Though god knows why anyone would *want* a case-sensitive anything > in an e-mail address. gun, foot and all that. *shudder* Humans tend to like mixed case. Computers tend to like case insenstive. Mailman currently hits a fairly happy middle ground. Eveyrthing having to do with an email address is processed lower case. Including list names. Everything that might be processed by a human, such as list messages, and member's addresses, are stored case-preserved. What's this mean? You can go into the web form and change the case on your list. From them on all list messages and web pages that refer to the list by name (as versus by address) will use the mixed case name. BUT, everything that refers to the list by email address will be in all lower case. I see this as a good middle groud. Nothing breaks, nothing gets hurt, there are no problems with name conflicts between lists of varying case, and no silly users get the weird ide that it might be fun to mess with case in email addresses (that don't already have that weird idea). -- J C Lawrence Home: claw(a)kanga.nu ---------(*) Other: coder(a)kanga.nu http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/ Keys etc: finger claw(a)kanga.nu --=| A man is as sane as he is dangerous to his environment |=--

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] lowercase listnames?
by Dan Mick 26 Jul '00

26 Jul '00

> >>>>> "DF" == Darrell Fuhriman <darrell(a)grumblesmurf.net> writes: > > DF> Though god knows why anyone would *want* a case-sensitive > DF> anything in an e-mail address. gun, foot and all that. > DF> *shudder* Some (many?) of us have no problem using case to distinguish things, and rely on it for modes of expression. > It has definitely come up in the past and caused people problems. > Probably not a majority of users, but still. Sure. "rm" causes problems for some users, too. > When you register an email address with Mailman, it case preserves the > localpart for purposes of sending out the messages, but it always > compares email addresses case insensitively. You can't subscribe two > addresses which differ only by case, ...and that's appropriate, since the SMTP systems won't deal with that either... > but when it sends out a message, > it will make sure to send it out with the exact address that was > subscribed. ...and this ought to be as true for the list name as it is for the user addresses.

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] lowercase listnames?
by Dan Mick 26 Jul '00

26 Jul '00

> > >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick <Dan.Mick(a)west.sun.com> writes: > > DM> That may be, but if I'd like my list to be called MyList as > DM> opposed to mylist, why should Mailman dictate that it can't? > > DM> For duplicate-checking, sure, lowercase it internally, but it > DM> seems wrong to lowercase it in places where it doesn't matter. > > Can you identify exactly where you'd like Mailman to case-preserve the > list names rather than lowercase them? Is it in the URLs, the mail > aliases, some place else? Well, no. As I said, someone on mailman-users was confused by the fact that newlist had done it, so that some other mailman bin/ command didn't recognize the both-case version of the name. And it just seems wrong. (Obviously the work would be identifying the few cases where case really should be immaterial, but by default, IMO, everything everywhere should follow the case originally entered to newlist unless it causes a problem.)

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] lowercase listnames?
by Dan Mick 26 Jul '00

26 Jul '00

> >>>>> "DM" == Dan Mick <Dan.Mick(a)West.Sun.COM> writes: > > DM> newlist lowercases the listname before creating it. Is there > DM> any good reason for this? Unix isn't case-insensitive; do we > DM> really want Mailman to be? > > I don't think it make sense to have two lists at a site that differ > only by case. That may be, but if I'd like my list to be called MyList as opposed to mylist, why should Mailman dictate that it can't? For duplicate-checking, sure, lowercase it internally, but it seems wrong to lowercase it in places where it doesn't matter.

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Re: [Mailman-Developers] lowercase listnames?
by Dan Mick 26 Jul '00

26 Jul '00

> > newlist lowercases the listname before creating it. Is there > > any good reason for this? Unix isn't case-insensitive; do we > > really want Mailman to be? > > Yes, we do, because it makes thing cleaner, and because RFC-822 says all > headers are case insensitive anyway. If the headers are case-insensitive, then we don't need to throw away that information.

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CONFIRMATION cash received
by Get Noticed 25 Jul '00

25 Jul '00

Subject: CONFIRMATION cash received Date: Wed, 19 Jul 2000 22:20:22 -0100 From: "Pat Dahlberg" <pdahlberg(a)home.com> To: <cyclefast333(a)hotmail.com>, <cwbnetwork(a)prontomail.com>, <crazyweeds(a)themail.com>, <coweb(a)btinternet.com>, <cosmicus(a)AllPaidFor.com>, <corey(a)idealsolutionsint.com>, <conrads1233(a)hotmail.com>, <concept(a)cgocable.net>, <commander114kh(a)yahoo.com>, <colorman(a)tm.net.my>, <co_op11(a)themail.com>, <cmilitzer51(a)yahoo.com>, <clivem(a)prontomail.com>, <cliff7646(a)aol.com>, <clickfordough(a)hotmail.com>, CC: <bbfoxley(a)integrityol.com>, <barsik(a)onebox.com>, <badgerfan(a)usa.com>, <babrandong(a)yahoo.com>, <azroute66(a)prontomail.com>, <AWestring(a)themail.com>, <avis1001(a)usa.net>, <avexpert(a)hotmail.com>, <autoform(a)websitedepartment.com>, <ausang(a)bigfoot.com>, <asmallbiz(a)go.to>, <askclaudia1(a)aol.com>, <ARTWORLD247(a)aol.com>, <aprev(a)alpha.mpl.uoa.gr>, <anie(a)div2000.com>, Subject: Parents Of 15-Year-Old Find Big $$$$$$$$$$ In His Closet It Works, Its Legal, Its Easy, Its Fun, so Why Not read this and play?!!! Parents of 15-year-old find $71,000 cash hidden in his closet. Does this headline look familiar? Of course it does. You most likely have just seen this story recently featured on a major nightly news program (USA). His mother was cleaning and putting laundry away when she came across a large brown paper bag that was suspiciously buried beneath some clothes and a skateboard in the back of her 15-year-old son's closet. Nothing could have prepared her for the shock she got when she opened the bag and found it was full of cash. Five dollar bills, twenties, fifties and hundreds - all neatly rubber-banded in labelled piles. "My first thought was that he had robbed a bank", says the 41-year-old woman, "There was over $71,000 dollars in that bag- that's more than my husband earns in a year". The woman immediately called her husband at the car-dealership where he worked to tell him what she'd discovered. He came home right away and they drove together to the boy's school and picked him up. Little did they suspect that where the money came from was more shocking than actually finding it in the closet. As it turns out, the boy had been sending out via E-mail on the Internet a type of 'chain-letter' to E-mail addresses that he obtained off of the Internet. Everyday after school for the past 2 months, he had been doing this right on his computer in his bedroom. "I just got the E-mail one day and I figured what the heck, I put my name on it like the instructions said and I started sending it out", says the clever 15-year-old. The E-mail letter listed 3 addresses and contained instructions to send one $5 dollar bill to the person at the top of the list, then delete that address and move the other 2 addresses up, and finally to add your name to the bottom of the list. The letter goes on to state that you would receive several thousand dollars in five dollar bills within 2 weeks if you sent out the letter with your name at the bottom of the 3-address list "I get junk E-mail all the time, and I really didn't think it was gonna work", the boy continues. Within the first few days of sending out the E-mail, the Post Office Box that his parents had gotten him for his video-game magazine subscriptions began to fill up with not magazines, but envelopes containing $5 dollar bills. "About a week later I rode [my bike] down to the post office and my box had 1 magazine and about 300 envelopes stuffed in it. There was also a yellow slip that said I had to go up to the [post office] counter- I thought I was in trouble or something (laughs)". He goes on, "I went up to the counter and they had a whole box of more mail for me. I had to ride back home and empty out my backpack 'cause I couldn't carry it all". Over the next few weeks, the boy continued sending out the E-mail. "The money just kept coming in and I just kept sorting it and stashing it in the closet, I barely had time for my homework". He had also been riding his bike to several of the area's banks and exchanging the $5 bills for twenties, fifties and hundreds. "I didn't want the banks to get suspicious so I kept riding to different banks with like five thousand at a time in my backpack. I would usually tell the lady at the bank counter that my dad had sent me in [to exchange the money] and he was outside waiting for me. One time the lady gave me a really strange look and told me that she wouldn't be able to do it for me and my dad would have to come in and do it, but I just rode to the next bank down the street (laughs)." Surprisingly, the boy didn't have any reason to be afraid. The reporting news team examined and investigated the so-called 'chain-letter' the boy was sending out and found that it wasn't a chain-letter at all. In fact, it was completely legal according to US Postal and Lottery Laws, Title 18, Section 1302 and 1341, or Title 18, Section 3005 in the US code, also in the code of federal regulations, Volume 16, Sections 255 and 436, which state a product or service must be exchanged for money received. Every five dollar bill that he received contained a little note that read, "Please add me to your mailing list". This simple note made the letter legal because he was exchanging a service (adding the purchasers name to his mailing list) for a five dollar fee. Here is the letter that the 15-year-old was sending out by E-mail, you can do the exact same thing he was doing, simply by following the instructions in this letter- -------------------------------------------- Here are instructions on how to make $10,000 US cash in the next 2 weeks: There are 3 addresses listed below. Send the person at the top of the list a $5 bill wrapped in 2 pieces of paper (to securely hide it), along with a note that says: "Please add me to your mailing list". Then delete that name, move the other 2 up and put your name at the bottom. Now start sending this ENTIRE e-mail back out to people. When 20 people receive it, those 20 people will move your name up to the middle position and they will each send out 20. That totals 400 people that will receive this letter with your name in the middle. Then, those 400 people will move your name up to the top and they will each send out 20 E-mails. That totals 8,000 people that will receive this E-mail with your name at the top and they will each send you a $5 bill. 8,000 people each sending you a $5 bill = $40,000 cash. That's if everyone responds to this E-mail, but not everyone will, so you can expect more realistically to receive about $10,000 cash $5 bills in your mailbox. This will work for anyone, anywhere in the world in any country, but send only a US CASH $5 bill. The more E-mails you send out, the more cash you will receive. If each person sends out 100 E-mails, there will be 1,000,000 people that receive this letter when your name reaches the top. If only 1% of those people respond, you will still get $50,000 cash. Here is the list: ---------------------------------------------------------- 1. Lillian Meyer 351 Issac Brock Stoney creek, Ontario Canada L8J1Y1 2. Tina Vemb 139 Dauphin Ave Kingston, Ontario Canada, Ontario K0H1G0 3. Regan Reaney 12 Prince Henry Drive Kingston, Ontario Canada K7M7S6 ---------------------------------------------------------- THERE'S NOTHING MORE TO DO. When your name reaches the top in a few days, you will start receiving $5 bills from other people just like yourself, who are willing to invest a $5 bill to receive $10,000 cash. Nothing ventured, nothing gained In the spirit of FUN, let's play...... This is not a SPAM! Recently, your email address was posted to one of our many ffa sites, safe email opt-in lists or you sent us an email. In an effort to remove all addresses that were posted in error or without the owners permission or bad addresses, we are implementing this confirmation system. IF YOU WISH TO BE REMOVED Please type "Remove" in the subject line and reply to this e-mail. http://hotyellow98.com/admore/index.html

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Templates and i18n
by Harald Wellmann 25 Jul '00

25 Jul '00

Maybe I'm off topic here, but I never had any feedback whatsoever when I posted the following to mailman-i18n, and in fact that list appears to be dormant if not dead ;-) I'm trying to get an idea how much effort it would be to modify the current mailman distribution for a German-speaking user community. >From the list archives, I don't get a clear idea of the current status of mailman i18n, and of course I'd like to avoid work that's already been done... * Could somebody please explain the role of the global and per-list template files? As far as I can see, the *.html templates per list simply get initialized from the global templates in PREFIX/templates and can be edited via the web interface. So if I translated all global template files before creating any lists on my site, I would end up with a more-or-less localized user interface, except for some English messages that are hard-coded in the sources -- am I right??? * Any German-speaking users out there who have already translated some templates they would like to share? * What's the status of the i18n project in mailman? Are there any intermediate results? Maybe there is an i18n branch in the CVS repository? Regards, -- Harald Wellmann

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Against CSS (CERT CA-2000-02)
by Tokio Kikuchi 24 Jul '00

24 Jul '00

Hi, Developers, While I am working on Japanese translation of Mailman, I realized there are many cases that HTML escaping (like < to <) are needed in view of CERT Advisory 2000-02, <http://www.cert.org/advisories/CA-2000-02.html>. This is also known as 'cross site scripting', see <http://www.apache.org/info/css-security/>. They are to be avoided by rewriting doc.AddItem(Bold('No such list %s' % listname)) to doc.AddItem(Bold('No such list %s' % cgi.escape(listname))) I hope these corrections will be done in the nearest future release. Thank you. -- Tokio Kikuchi, tkikuchi(a)is.kochi-u.ac.jp http://weather.is.kochi-u.ac.jp/

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qfiles & develop list weirdness
by Ricardo Kustner 24 Jul '00

24 Jul '00

Hi, On saturday i noticed that a lot of posts of our lists arrived very late or not at all... when i decided to have a look at the qfiles directory, I noticed that there were more than 22,000 files (yikes!) in that directory... dating back to july 17... i saw some errors from the bounce handler so I decided to remove all mailer-daemon/postmaster message from the queue and upgraded to a freshly new CVS installation... it seems to work ok now; maybe it had to do with some of the bugs discovered in beta4... One other weird thing is that i haven't been receiving anymore mail from the mailman developers list since july 17, even though the archive shows posts from this friday and on the subscription page the mail delivery is _not_ disabled for my address... Barry do you have any idea what's going on? Ricardo. -- http://rixhq.nu "You think that's air you're breathing?" -- Morpheus

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Patch for list-specific templates/ files
by Dan Mick 22 Jul '00

22 Jul '00

I have wanted this for some time, and someone asked on mailman-users, so I hacked something up; being better at CVS than I have been, I made a patch and posted it. Here's what I posted to mailman-users: Patch #100953 (on sourceforge) allows list-specific files; you put them in ~mailman/lists/<listname>/ , and they're used in preference to the ones in ~mailman/templates for that list. It was a bit dodgy how I had to do it; the list object wasn't previously passed to Utils.maketext(), so I had to find all the callers of maketext and add the list object to the call params. Mostly, the change is in Utils.py, but there's a slight touch to a lot of other files. I'll submit this over on mailman-developers and see if anyone has any comments, but it seems to work. Of course it's only valid against the current CVS snapshot as of right now (Barry's been changing a lot tonight preparing for beta5).

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