Hi all,
I'm an engineer at Google in Chicago (working on java not python:) but also
a former math/science teacher interested in meeting up for EduPython this
year. I've been following the list via feeds though, sadly, haven't had
much time to participate. I'm glad PyCon is in town this year and look
forward to attending this year's conference as well as the friday and
saturday nite edu-sig BOF.
If folks are interested, I can offer up a meeting/tour at our office in
River North. I added …
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Thanks and hope to see soon,
Jessie Chavez
Software Engineer
Google, Inc. - Chicago
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So what's instead of reload in Python 3.x?
I did some Googling, got stuff like:
http://www.techlists.org/archives/programming/pythonlist/2007-08/msg04244.s…
I've been enjoying the EuroPython logo contest, lots of cool entries:
http://controlroom.blogspot.com/2008/02/pythonic-art.htmlhttp://controlroom.blogspot.com/2008/02/new-entries.html
Probably any books in production should take 3.x as the new standard
right? Even if we go back to 2.x in the sidebars, to help new students
understand …
[View More]an older code base.
Running a2 on my Ubuntu Dell, with IDLE 'n everything.
I haven't rewritten my own 4D Solutions code base yet, so it's not like
I'm in a big hurry or anything. 3.x is in alpha, not in production.
But books are different from electronic files, in terms of sheer bulk
and lag time to market. Ending up on the culling table at Fry's too
soon is bad for business.
I anticipate fewer school books, more Safari-like services, even if you
ask for hardcopy in places -- not by government edict (though govt still
wastes too much paper IMO), more market forces, the result of
individuals trying to stay up to date (like how *do* you, without a
subscription? without RSS?).
Kirby
4D
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My projects have brought me to "lesson plan as python module"
or "python module as lesson plan" concept, a quasi no-brainer
for a lotta ya already, i.e. it's what you've been doing all along.
The "lesson reading / plan = Python module" idea connects to
the rich data structures idea (also a thread on comp.lang.python
not so long ago too). Like you might keep your Periodic Table of
Elements on the side, in some text-based format, and pipe
it in with a reader, or you might start with it already …
[View More]in a
Pythonic data structure (it's not either/or), e.g. a module with
each element a class instance of Atom, with attributes protons
and neutrons etc. (why reinvent the wheel?).
Here's a link to a home grown example of recent vintage,
floating around among teachers:
http://www.4dsolutions.net/ocn/python/global_matrix.py
Note that much of the verbiage is about the knowledge domain
(hexapent geometry -- HP4E is one of my pet projects, named in
honor of CP4E). The lesson isn't so much about the Python
implementation, which is quite trivial in this case i.e. is not
a "big code" example (very minimal Python 3.x).
What we expect are many similar modules but with at least
the comments sections swapped out, replaced with text in
other languages, including left to right cursives -- the promise
of Unicode. Your on-ramp to programming doesn't *have*
to mean complete immersion in Latin-1.
The format is simple enough that individual teachers now swap
these around i.e. we're not trying to go for an embeddable XML
type solution, documentation directives, just native Python in
these examples, cut and pastable into any reasonably Unicode-
aware text editor.**
Kirby
4D
** I'm aware of other fancy skinning techniques, some with tools
for easy code extraction -- again, it's not either/or.
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So I've been cavorting in J-world some (Jsoftware.com). That's
another math-through-programming REPL, in the tradition of APL and
ISETL. Been blogging as usual, plus watching the EuroPython thing
gel.
A local gig in the private sector led to a big Chicago-based firm
thinking highly of Python (some buzzcrawler app my friend Patrick
wrote, after attending my classes). I get the impression that word is
still spreading, the buzz about Python still getting going.
Like this head hunter I talked …
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learn about Python. I pointed her to O'Reilly's famous "history of
programming languages" time line (not up to date, but still highly
informative). Follow-up meeting on Tuesday.
Our Portland User Group (PUG) list has been fun lately, with basic /
core Python advice (Jason sure knows those itertools).
I'm still working with TECC, an Alaska based charter still on the
drawing board, and a possible outlet for Pythonic Math products,
forged here in Bridge City aka Portland. LEP High, off the drawing
board (in the sense of fully operational) already had me in for a test
drive. Heavy emphasis on peer-to-peer learning, like with Kusasa.
TECC's founder, Anna Roys, walked away with my copy of John Zelle's
book (my gift to her youngest). Her family already invests in C++, or
was it C#. Anyway, there's definitely a talent pool around Anchorage
taking shape on my radar (I haven't managed to jet up there yet though
-- way busy in PDX). More on the math-teach list (Math Forum @
Drexel).
So we'll probably do cellular automata, fractals, the kind of eye
candy stuff we've talked a whole lot about here over the years
(surprise surprise).Kevin's PythonCard demos also fit here, plus lead
into code samples around how to leverage wxPython (see below).
Portland is heavily into nanotech. Seems like CA studies and nanotech
also wind up co-mingling.
I find it useful to distinguish between Python packages written by pro
programmers like Kevin, and helpful to students in various walks of
life (e.g. Alice, no longer in Python), versus more Pippy-like stuff,
where the assumption is that users want direct access to some
calculator-like REPL, will do their own coding, maybe with some
scaffolding (e.g. a vector class, or something to write povray or x3d
files (why reinvent the wheel?)).
My company's output has focused mostly on the Pippy-like angle, moving
to other APIs only recently. Others here are into providing deeper
packages, stuff students might use without trying to poke around in
the source code too much, which code is way above the beginner level.
Doesn't mean they can't do that eventually of course. Go back to that
turtle, figure out what made it tick.
In between, are self-teaching products, i.e. learning tools that also
teach how to write rather elaborate programs (way above the "sequences
and series" of OEIS vintage that I focus on -- using Python generators
more often than not (many examples already given, I'll spare you the
repetition, plus "next syntax" has changed with 3.x, so a lot of my
stuff needs a rewrite)).
PyGeo falls into this category (a self-teaching product), in that
Arthur was looking to new recruit bona fide "code warriors", not just
students of projective geometry (the knowledge domain for this
package).
Environments like Leo suggest themselves at this juncture, as if
you're taking students deep into a source code forest, a lot will
depend on friendly documentation, a sense that you have a clear guide.
The fact of a Unicode basis also means these heavily documented code
piles take internationalization for granted (not true when I was first
cutting teeth as a coder of text based, then GUI apps).
Python is such a fertile mixing ground because it attracts the
minimalist REPL people, coming from Iverson's APL/J pipeline, (I'd
count myself in this group), *and* maximalist writers of "big code"
such as Zope. We don't exactly compete, just come from different ends
on the spectrum, meeting in some happy middle ground.
A lot of us wear more than one hat on this small-to-large spectrum,
e.g. write unit tested embellishments by day, as part of a team, churn
out reams of disposable hobby code by night ("programming just for the
fun of it").
IDLE itself is a good symbol of this middle ground, in that it's what
gives minimalists their 5-10 liners, tiny modules of 2-3 classes (4D
Solutions: permutations, game of life on a hexapent, fractals, NKS
stuff, polyhedra...), yet is itself a substantial package, based
around Tkinter, and requiring a team of maintainers, continuing what
Guido started.
Along one path you might move to MathCad say, or some other terse
notation (generators first, sigma notation to follow). Along another,
you could drill down into IDLE or Pygeo or Plone or whatever, and
start seeing what deep, complicated Python programs look like under
the hood. Keep digging to the system layer and below, if that's your
calling (all the way to the chip in some cases).
In sum, what I like about Python is that you can introduce it without
too much bias, to both "minimalists" and "maximalists". Students at
the intro level get to share the same basic curriculum, and yet divide
up at the next level, now having more to go on to make an informed
choice -- exactly what one wants in a CS0 (or in some exotic hybrid
"gnu math" sequence such as we're sourcing from Portland).
Kirby
4Dsolutions.net
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Was there ever a time figured out for the BOF in Chicago - or will we
figure it out when we get there?
I am looking forward to is as I am teaching intro programming in
Python for the first tie this semester and would like to learn from
other folks teaching starting programmers.
Charles Severance
University of Michigan
www.dr-chuck.com
Hey, everyone...
I've just put a placeholder down for us on the BoF wiki page for PyCon -
http://wiki.python.org/moin/Birds_of_a_Feather - I assume some of us
will want to get together in Chicago. The question, as always, is where
and when...
Cheers,
Vern
--
This time for sure!
-Bullwinkle J. Moose
-----------------------------
Vern Ceder, Director of Technology
Canterbury School, 3210 Smith Road, Ft Wayne, IN 46804
vceder(a)canterburyschool.org; 260-436-0746; FAX: 260-436-5137
