Mailman 3 March 2009 - Edu-sig

Updating the edu-sig page
by Andre Roberge 29 Mar '09

29 Mar '09

Hi everyone, I have been given permission to edit the edu-sig page ( http://www.python.org/community/sigs/current/edu-sig/) on the official Python web site. Think of me as the Benevolent Edu-Sig Slave For Now, answering to the community as to what changes you'd like to see being made on that page. So, I am looking for community input as to what kind of changes you'd like to see. Before you go wild with suggestions, I'd like to share a some observations and a suggestion. 1. Doing changes to that page involves an official commit to the svn repository. As other people might be monitoring changes, I don't want to overwhelm them with tons of small commits. 2.a) There is a lot of material on that page that is duplicated (sometimes poorly) with information that can be found elsewhere. For example, the section "Shells and Editors" contains links to http://wiki.python.org/moin/PythonEditors and http://wiki.python.org/moin/IntegratedDevelopmentEnvironments, in addition to actual links to a few tools. 2.b) Note the "wiki" part of the two links mentioned in 2.a) above. This means that YOU can edit such pages, without having to send me an email with you thoughts, waiting for me to act on it, worrying about me selectively editing the information you submit, etc. So, I am thinking that the edu-sig page should become a high level description of what is available elsewhere and that a lot of the "meat" should be actually hosted on wiki.python.org - which could be kept up to date much more easily and much more effectively by the community as a whole. Yours, André

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Re: [Edu-sig] [OLPC-Chicago] OLPC/Sugar dinner this weekend - with Pycon guests!
by Jeff Elkner 28 Mar '09

28 Mar '09

So far only Andre Roberge has confirmed that he will join us. I did not make reservations yet since if it only the three of us I don't think we will need them. I can't email the olpc-chicago list since it is subscribers only (Andy, can you help with this please?). My last email to that list bounced. On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 2:52 PM, Mel Chua <mel(a)melchua.com> wrote: > Can you do me a favor since I'm about to not have net access, and email the > olpc-chicago list with the location change? 847.970.8484 is my # in case > anyone (on any list) has q's. > > Thanks! > > --Mel (RSI hates me atm) > > Jeff Elkner wrote: > >> Hi Mel, >> >> I'll try to get you a count at our edu-sig dinner this evening. >> >> Two questions: >> >> 1. Are we meeting for breakfast tomorrow? >> 2. Have you decided on a restaurant for tomorrow evening yet? >> >> Please include Andrew Harrington in your reply, since he knows Chicago and >> has been assuming the role of coordinating the edu-sig activities at the >> conference. >> >> Thanks! >> >> jeff >> >> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 11:29 AM, Mel Chua <mel(a)melchua.com <mailto: >> mel(a)melchua.com>> wrote: >> >> Jeff Elkner wrote: >> >> Most of the educationally related talks will be given >> back-to-back this morning, so we'll have the opportunity to >> gather the tribe. >> >> >> Rock. If you can send-to-list a headcount (rough, even) before... >> noon tomorrow, that would rock. I plan on calling the restaurant >> after my lunch meetings, so knowing who'll be around would be cool. >> (And also let me stock up on browser tabs to preload in my XO in >> case we need info for reference while chatting.) >> >> So far I know Matt and I will be there, and am waiting for more >> "I'll be coming!" emails to fill in the other seats. ;) >> >> --Mel >> >> >>

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OLPC/Sugar Saturday dinner...
by Jeff Elkner 28 Mar '09

28 Mar '09

Mel Chua from OLPC and Sugar Labs will be dropping by PyCon this evening to talk about what is going on with Sugar and OLPC. We will meet in front of the PyCon registration desk at 6:15 pm and head out to dinner. I told her I would try to round up other interested folks and make reservations for dinner somewhere. Two requests: 1. If you are interested, please reply to this message or let me know if you see my in the halls at Pycon. 2. If you know a reasonable place to eat walking distance from the Hyatt, please let me know. If I don't hear anything I'll make a reservation at the same Mexican place where we ate last night. Thanks! jeff

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xturtle robocode idea?!
by Jurgis Pralgauskis 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

Hello, I've been searching around for python analogue of robocode... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robocode I found just some unfinished experiments but then I thought xturte should be ideal for this: - supors 2d movement :) - supports multiple turtles - has ontimer event as well as onkey (http://xturtle.rg16.at/code/xtx_games/xtx_spaceship.py) maybe smb has tried or wants to try to make little framework for this? I saw robocode in action ~5 years ago when my friend was teaching java maybe now it has more features but then it was enought to gather the prepaired bots' logics (from each student) and run them locally alltogether... and it was really fun and involving ;) bot had information abour the field and coordinates of other bots (and they flying missles) and could decide on direction changing or fireing.. that's all :) -- Jurgis Pralgauskis Don't worry, be happy and make things better ;) http://sagemath.visiems.lt

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Re: [Edu-sig] [OLPC-Chicago] OLPC/Sugar dinner this weekend - with Pycon guests!
by Jeff Elkner 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

Hi Mel, I'll try to get you a count at our edu-sig dinner this evening. Two questions: 1. Are we meeting for breakfast tomorrow? 2. Have you decided on a restaurant for tomorrow evening yet? Please include Andrew Harrington in your reply, since he knows Chicago and has been assuming the role of coordinating the edu-sig activities at the conference. Thanks! jeff On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 11:29 AM, Mel Chua <mel(a)melchua.com> wrote: > Jeff Elkner wrote: > >> Most of the educationally related talks will be given back-to-back this >> morning, so we'll have the opportunity to gather the tribe. >> > > Rock. If you can send-to-list a headcount (rough, even) before... noon > tomorrow, that would rock. I plan on calling the restaurant after my lunch > meetings, so knowing who'll be around would be cool. (And also let me stock > up on browser tabs to preload in my XO in case we need info for reference > while chatting.) > > So far I know Matt and I will be there, and am waiting for more "I'll be > coming!" emails to fill in the other seats. ;) > > --Mel >

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Re: [Edu-sig] The Crunchy Way
by David MacQuigg 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

At 03:34 PM 3/27/2009 -0300, Andre Roberge wrote: >On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 2:26 PM, David MacQuigg <<mailto:macquigg@ece.arizona.edu>macquigg(a)ece.arizona.edu> wrote: >>At 11:30 AM 3/27/2009 -0500, kirby urner wrote: >> >>>So Croquant is like a delivery tool, where the lesson plans >>>accumulate. PyWhip is similar but more static (making the content >>>Wiki based is likely to promote organic growth). >> >>Not quite sure what you mean here. Could you be more specific? >> >>Anyone can contribute problems to PyWhip, including students. I expect we will have a huge accumulation, and the final quality will be determined by how well we chose the best, and how well get these collections organized into a good learning sequence. >> >>Currently PyWhip more like Citizendium than Wikipedia. Teachers (editors) control the content. We are talking about expanding this to allow anyone to be a teacher, and register a setup. Students who select that setup, will then see whatever problems their teacher wants them to see. > >Since what I said in my talk is at the origin of Kirby's post, perhaps I should be the one to clarify. > >In my talk about Crunchy, I mentioned and showed (very superficially) both PyWhip and Croquant. Croquant is a MoinMoin extension that allows to add additional markup which Crunchy can recognize and insert the requested interactive element (e.g. Python interpreter, doctest, unittest, editor, etc.) inside the browser window. Because Croquant == MoinMoin, it is a purely collaborative media where no one is the single author (with exclusive editing rights) of any example. Someone setting a Croquant server could create a site where doctest-based problems would accumulate organically (like Wikedia). But Croquant is static - you need to view it with Crunchy to have the interaction. > >PyWhip, by contrast, includes both the editing and interacting features in one app/site. However, to use your expression, it is more like Citizendium than Wikipedia - which is essentially what I attempted to convey in my talk. I think the essential question here is - should we allow one author to edit another's work, or preserve the original and ask the new author to submit a new problem, even if it just a minor edit of the original. We're going with the latter for now, but at this point, anything is open for discussion. If the new problem is a variation on the original, different numbers, etc., then we can include them both. These are exercises. Repetition is OK. At some point we may want to limit the number of problems, but we are no where near that limit now. If the new problem is a correction of some deficiency in the original - an ambiguous question, etc., then the original author has the option of including the correction in his original. If the original author chooses not to include the correction, then the editors will have to decide whether to use the original or the corrected version. There will never be a Wikipedia-style "edit war". >And I did invite everyone (I would say over 100 people present) in my talk to go to PyWhip and contribute at least one problem! Just so everyone understands, Andre is a contributor to PyWhip with full SVN access. If there is any "competition" between PyWhip and Crunchy, it is entirely friendly. I'm assuming all code will be available under GPL, but that is actually for Athar to decide, since he wrote it. I think this answers Kirby's question in the next message. 99% of the value will be in the content, not the website coding. Among the developers, I have proposed, and nobody has objected, that we use the Creative Commons license. If this is acceptable, we will have something like this in a pop-up which appears when an author clicks SUBMIT: By clicking ACCEPT, you are certifying 1) The problem you are submitting is your own work, or is a derivative work consistent with the original author's license. 2) You agree that your submission will be licensed under the Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike license <http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0>http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-sa/3.0 This means that others may modify and share your work under the same license. [ACCEPT] [DECLINE] -- Dave

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Edu-sig at Pycon
by Andrew Harrington 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

Pycon attenders, Remember our dinner at 6:45PM Friday night! If you have not already let me know you are coming, email me and/or make an entry on the BoF page http://us.pycon.org/2009/openspace/EduSig/ -- Andrew N. Harrington Director of Academic Programs Computer Science Department Loyola University Chicago 512B Lewis Towers (office) Snail mail to Lewis Towers 416 820 North Michigan Avenue Chicago, Illinois 60611 http://www.cs.luc.edu/~anh Phone: 312-915-7982 Fax: 312-915-7998 gpd(a)cs.luc.edu for graduate administration upd(a)cs.luc.edu for undergrad administration aharrin(a)luc.edu as professor

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Re: [Edu-sig] The Crunchy Way
by David MacQuigg 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

At 11:30 AM 3/27/2009 -0500, kirby urner wrote: >PyWhip is moving in the same direction. > >Using unittest is another option (instead of doctest). So far, I've been able to get doctest to do anything I need in testing, even some fairly complex tests involving multiple functions, pre-test setup, post-test analysis, etc. The unittest module feels more like a tool for professional programmers working on a big Java project. Even with all that complex setup, you still need doctests, so you'll end up doing both. doctest is cool, because the learning barrier is zero! Test your function by calling it from the >>> prompt. Cut and paste to the function's docstring, and your doctest is complete. >So Croquant is like a delivery tool, where the lesson plans >accumulate. PyWhip is similar but more static (making the content >Wiki based is likely to promote organic growth). Not quite sure what you mean here. Could you be more specific? Anyone can contribute problems to PyWhip, including students. I expect we will have a huge accumulation, and the final quality will be determined by how well we chose the best, and how well get these collections organized into a good learning sequence. Currently PyWhip more like Citizendium than Wikipedia. Teachers (editors) control the content. We are talking about expanding this to allow anyone to be a teacher, and register a setup. Students who select that setup, will then see whatever problems their teacher wants them to see. -- Dave

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The Crunchy Way
by kirby urner 27 Mar '09

27 Mar '09

I'm in 'Learning and Teaching Python Programming: The Crunchy Way' by Dr. Andre Roberge. This would be the "Python for Educators" track, only informally defined (as a namespace?) at Pycon. There's a BOF later. He's claiming to be an imposter (we don't believe him) because he isn't teaching Python these days (except he is, right now). He used to teach physics, knows about pedagogy. A goal is to screen scrape, find code in <pre> tags, and supplies an interactive shell box. "VLAM" -- very little added markup. Crunchy "eats" HTML pages (good name then -- no Frog anymore). This is an effective way to present a Python talk then: write your slides in HTML and run 'em through Crunchy. "A regular Python interpreter inside the web browser". Interpreter errors are intercepted and may be reprinted in different languages (human languages). By toggling the editor you get an embedded WYSIWYG editor. You can actually load and save files from your local tree in this system. Go ahead an launch any program in a separate process / window (Pyglet demo -- bouncing balls). Ian: "Are you listening to this?" Me: (nodding) "yeah, writting about it". He's showing a dynamically generated graph coming into the web page -- very AJAXy. The doctest module helps with test-driven learning. Very TDD (test driven development). Show double(arg) --> arg*2 working first, challenge page reader to write the code in an editor box. The doctests get applied (duck typing -- you could pass the tests with a faux function I bet...). PyWhip is moving in the same direction. Using unittest is another option (instead of doctest). Ian: "this is very powerful!" You can pick an analyzer, e.g. pyflakes, pychecker and analyze the code. There's a "code quality" measure, which varies depending on which analyzer is chosen. The "editarea" widget is really cool. You can vary the size, go to full page -- very capable. Now he's showing stepping through with PDB, showing the local namespace (in yellow the first time -- then white if it's "old", the red if it changes). There's also an output window. Croquant (French for Crunchy) is a complement to Crunchy, an extension of MoinMoin that adds the VLAM so when loading from a Croquant wiki, you have Crunchy-ready content. So Croquant is like a delivery tool, where the lesson plans accumulate. PyWhip is similar but more static (making the content Wiki based is likely to promote organic growth). Crunchy allows plugins (a talk in itself). There's an experimental turtle module (I knew there was a turtle in here somewhere -- glad to see I'm not completely off the wall in remembering that). He'd like to collaborate on some of the issues (security, user accounts...). Crunchy is not meant as a main IDE so much as a learning tool, reading/writing Python in classroom situations. Q&A: one of the A/V guys has a question (some of our A/V volunteers are also Python developers -- others not). Crunchy is designed to be used on your own machine (you the learner, student, run Crunchy locally). Great talk! I'll definitely put a chip in the "green bucket". Kirby

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Why MIT switched from Scheme to Python
by Daniel Ajoy 26 Mar '09

26 Mar '09

http://www.wisdomandwonder.com/link/2110/why-mit-switched-from-scheme-to-py… Daniel

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